Sport Bikes banner

1 - 20 of 76 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I went to MAM this last weekend I realized a couple things one I am not as rich as most of the people second I like riding more than winning. Even if I won but went slow I would be pissed. times around the track are not even that important. Riding the GSXR1000 with gods own engine and the jesters suspension taught me that the real meaning of lap times is what you risk more than what you know. How much money you have is also a big factor. Got 50k a year to race no well just get over it many do. There are some that spend 10K just on their motor get over it. There is also always someone that is going to try to make you go slower as the competition is to get to the finish line beore others not to go fast.


Alright for the plus. Insane speeds you are never going to be pushed quite as hard on a track day. It is not hard to get fast enough to make it very rare to get passed at a track day. This pushes you. You have tons of fast people around so you can learn by example. You also end up riding with the same people all the time so you get to know everyone fast. Lots of help at a race and a lot of people that really know how to ride and fix things. If you crash in a race no one is going to make fun of you that has to be one of the best things of all. The peanut crowd is silenced for racing stupidity.


Plus for track days. Tons more riding for the same cost. If the red flag flags people get off the track who whats to be the first off the track and have colder tires on the restart than the next just because the ambulance goes out?! No one is trying to make you ride slower so if you dont have a HP advantage or weighty advantage you are not going to be held back by someone doing a good job of blocking and a poor job of riding.



I guess the question remains why race? It can be fun. I got some fantastic laps in on the last race before they Finlay called the red flag. Passing all the nice bikes with race fuel, pipes tuned suspension and the whole nine yards many on the outside in turns. Of course my lap timer and the bikes transponder were not working so who knows what the lap times were- yea I do like to silence the peanut crowd too. On the restart I almost crashed and realized I was not Biaggi.



Went from last place to middle of the pack in a few laps even with a poor start. Drank beer and ate brots from the grill and finally got my suspension to work right with the heat helping out. Lots of great people at the races too though I must say the truck sized BBQ at nesba and the 6 foot fan at Gate way beat that hands down.


In short I am not going to quit but then I am not going to jump though hoops to get to the races either there are plenty of track days to go too and you dont need to spend the big bucks to go full speed either.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,269 Posts
Dude it does not take 50K to race, nor do you need to spend 10K on a motor to be fast in the Amature Class...Maybe Expert, but not Amature...

Track Days are nothing in comparison to Racing. You said and I agree that you will never push yourself as hard or go as fast doing track days vs. Racing...

Why Race? If you are competitive, want to get faster and be a better rider, then race. You can do track days until you are blue in the face, but you won't get any faster doing the same things over and over again. You do that racing, and you will find yourself in last place every race, and then racing is no fun...

Racing is an all or nothing thing in my book. No point in racing if you are just going to do a few weekends here and there. You never get into the grove, and your attitude about racing dosn't change from the generalized track day attitude.

In attiditon to racing is being able to ride on lots of different tracks. I learned a great deal from Black Hawk which I applied to MAM, and as a result I was running 1:39's consistanly all weekend long, that's a 6 second drop. Would I have had the same results just doing MotoMania at MAM until I am blue in the face and not race? No way... You can put a million laps around a track, but if it is the same time, every time, what do you learn?

That is what racing is all about...Learning. If you want to learn, experiance new things, etc. Then Race. If not, then track days offer the best vaule to agressive street riding in my book.

The only advantage I see to track days is nothing more than a Test N' Tune day for that track, so that when I race there, I have a good suspension baseline...

That's how I feal...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
extrakt0r said:
Dude it does not take 50K to race, nor do you need to spend 10K on a motor to be fast in the Amature Class...Maybe Expert, but not Amature...

Track Days are nothing in comparison to Racing. You said and I agree that you will never push yourself as hard or go as fast doing track days vs. Racing...

Why Race? If you are competitive, want to get faster and be a better rider, then race. You can do track days until you are blue in the face, but you won't get any faster doing the same things over and over again. You do that racing, and you will find yourself in last place every race, and then racing is no fun...

Racing is an all or nothing thing in my book. No point in racing if you are just going to do a few weekends here and there. You never get into the grove, and your attitude about racing dosn't change from the generalized track day attitude.

In attiditon to racing is being able to ride on lots of different tracks. I learned a great deal from Black Hawk which I applied to MAM, and as a result I was running 1:39's consistanly all weekend long, that's a 6 second drop. Would I have had the same results just doing MotoMania at MAM until I am blue in the face and not race? No way... You can put a million laps around a track, but if it is the same time, every time, what do you learn?

That is what racing is all about...Learning. If you want to learn, experiance new things, etc. Then Race. If not, then track days offer the best vaule to agressive street riding in my book.

The only advantage I see to track days is nothing more than a Test N' Tune day for that track, so that when I race there, I have a good suspension baseline...

That's how I feal...

OK here is the diffrence real short...... like to ride VS like to win:bitchslap. Read a little clocer. It is your own fault that your times suck in pratice- that and a green track.

You obviously have not tried passing someone with more HP it is fun except they just pass you in the strait and get in the way when a corner comes. There are not exatly a ton of new 1000's on the track. Get a 600 or ride brandys r1 if she will let you and see how the guys on the other side of the railroad track live.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,269 Posts
smokenjoe said:
It is your own fault that your times suck in pratice- that and a green track.
My times suck? Are you smoking crack? Did you run 38's at MAM this last weekend? Or even 39's? How many races did you win? How many did you even get a top 5 in? Ohhhh... I was off my pace the first 2 days due to track conditions and suspension issues? That is what Pratice is for, work out issue, times only matter bettwen green and checkerd flags..

I can hear it now...I have an 600 and you have an 1000...So f'n what? So does Matt Hall, Hell even Spooner has a 4 year old bike, was running 39's and 40's and was handing you your ass all weekend long. In addition to that you have been to MAM a million times and I have been 4. I was timing you and you were lucky to get in the 43's with a clear track in front of you...

I wasn't trying to be a dick, but I am sick of people saying "I need a million dollars to race, have the best bike etc." Briar had that same bike before you...did he run 43's at MAM and 44's at Heartland Park?

Fine, you like to ride vs win. I am the same way, winning is nothing more than a bonus in my eyes. I like to ride and get as fast as I can be.

You obviously need to stick to track days. I don't know where you get off saying my times suck, and I am slow when I have been riding for less than a year and run quicker times than you. :bitchslap
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
OK Rob I said "It is your own fault that your times suck in pratice- that and a green track." Learn to read dude. :chair



You said it yourself you can't just go out and ride and have fun that is sad.

I remember the last time I talked with Rob he went livid when I said my lap timer did not work saying that it was impossible as he got his to work. There were other thing said but that was a very big deal to him.


Hello If you were paying attention you might have noted that the only laps I got with a free track in front of me was the last race and no transponder go figure. Yea it was on the bike Rob. Take some time from patting yourself on the back why dont you.

:popcorn
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,269 Posts
smokenjoe said:
OK Rob I said "It is your own fault that your times suck in pratice- that and a green track." Learn to read dude. :chair

You said it yourself you can't just go out and ride and have fun that is sad.

I remember the last time I talked with Rob he went livid when I said my lap timer did not work saying that it was impossible as he got his to work. There were other thing said but that was a very big deal to him.


Hello If you were paying attention you might have noted that the only laps I got with a free track in front of me was the last race. Take some time from patting yourself on the back why dont you.

:popcorn
You said in pratice - that and a green track <- "AND A GREEN TRACK" to me that meens, racing, Green Flag, Green Track, Racing. Maybe I mis-understood, but either way my point(s) still stand.

I don't know where you think I said "I can't go out and ride and have fun"

On the street? Yeah riding on the street sucks. Last year it was fun. This year it sucks.

On the track? Again, don't know what you are talking about. I have loads of fun doing both track days and racing. I can't get enuf. I just treat the two differently.

Look man, I don't want to get into a I ran these times, you ran these. There is no point. I could really care less what times your run or anyone else runs, that is until I get called out, just like this.

My whole point was that when you say "Racing is for the Rich" and that is basically what you have said in both your posts, I am saying I totally disagree. Having Money and Having the best bike, etc does not make you go fast. It helps, but it is not necesarliy the only reason a person can or can't go fast.

Yeah you are going to go "Faster" with a better suspension than stock, faster with a better motor. But to blame all your dislikes about racing "Becuase you are not Rich" is BS IMO...

And besides I am Rob #2 :bitchslap

:)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Serously try racing 600's even once. You will get faster trust me on this one. If you want to be able to compete agenst the big boys that is what I would want to do. That guy next to me was doing 37's on a R6 and bitching about it quietly...... with a stock pipe now that is impressive!

You dont need money to go fast but racing is not just about going fast when there is a full field. It is getting in front of the next guy. MAM was a blast dont get me wrong.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
617 Posts
Yeah Kurt Stock (the guy next to Joe) got down to :36's..!! All he has is suspension work. I did give him some VP in the UNGP and he got 9th so he was flat flyin.

Mike knows that I think he should try racing a 600 before the liter bike, but that topic has been beaten to death. Yes racing a 600 will make you a better rider so that you can use the bike to the full potential rather than use it to make up for lack of skill.

I do agree it doesn't take much money to fast either-its much more about knowing how to set up your bike than anything. Riding ability isn't a bad thing to have either as Briar showed us last year-not a clue how to set up the bike, but was running :36's last year at HPT with a bone stock R6!

-Spoon
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,269 Posts
Spooner said:
Mike knows that I think he should try racing a 600 before the liter bike, but that topic has been beaten to death. Yes racing a 600 will make you a better rider so that you can use the bike to the full potential rather than use it to make up for lack of skill.

I do agree it doesn't take much money to fast either-its much more about knowing how to set up your bike than anything. Riding ability isn't a bad thing to have either as Briar showed us last year-not a clue how to set up the bike, but was running :36's last year at HPT with a bone stock R6!

-Spoon
Yeah, it would have been nice to start on a 600, but since I was a poser, squid, etc last year the R1 looked to coolest and that is why I got it, over a 600. Did I even have the smallest idea I would race a full season 12 months ago...no way...

Do it all over again...Would I get a 600, still probably no...I have come a long way since my 1st track day, and even my 1st race(s) I admit I parked it in the corners, and flew down the straights, only to park it again. Do I still do it? Maybe a little. I don't park it any more, but what I do now is not get on the gas as soon as say a 600, so it may still look like I still don't have the same corner speed as a 600, but I am getting there...

As Super Dave has shown me, the bike and it's setup in 95% of the speed battle. If you don't get good feal and feadback from your bike, you are not going to go fast. Unless you are like Briar and are just fast regardless of the bike, but it is my understanding the Briar crashes alot, so that may be part of that (No offense to Briar intended...)

Anyway, I feal that I have done a great job mastering the R1 on the track. I have not killed myself, or wrecked yet. Had a few close one's but I have babied her and she has treated me well. Would I recommend it to someone else? Maybe...it really depends on the person.

I have made it hard on myself by straping 170HP between my legs. It takes more self control and patience to learn on a 1000 on the street let alone on the track...

I feal I have come along way in the 3 months of track and racing I have done.....

:)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Spooner said:
Yeah Kurt Stock (the guy next to Joe) got down to :36's..!! All he has is suspension work. I did give him some VP in the UNGP and he got 9th so he was flat flyin.

Mike knows that I think he should try racing a 600 before the liter bike, but that topic has been beaten to death. Yes racing a 600 will make you a better rider so that you can use the bike to the full potential rather than use it to make up for lack of skill.

I do agree it doesn't take much money to fast either-its much more about knowing how to set up your bike than anything. Riding ability isn't a bad thing to have either as Briar showed us last year-not a clue how to set up the bike, but was running :36's last year at HPT with a bone stock R6!

-Spoon

Dam 36 on a stock R6 :beer his name is really stock? :lao
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
extrakt0r said:
Yeah, it would have been nice to start on a 600, but since I was a poser, squid, etc last year the R1 looked to coolest and that is why I got it, over a 600. Did I even have the smallest idea I would race a full season 12 months ago...no way...

Do it all over again...Would I get a 600, still probably no...I have come a long way since my 1st track day, and even my 1st race(s) I admit I parked it in the corners, and flew down the straights, only to park it again. Do I still do it? Maybe a little. I don't park it any more, but what I do now is not get on the gas as soon as say a 600, so it may still look like I still don't have the same corner speed as a 600, but I am getting there...

As Super Dave has shown me, the bike and it's setup in 95% of the speed battle. If you don't get good feal and feadback from your bike, you are not going to go fast. Unless you are like Briar and are just fast regardless of the bike, but it is my understanding the Briar crashes alot, so that may be part of that (No offense to Briar intended...)

Anyway, I feal that I have done a great job mastering the R1 on the track. I have not killed myself, or wrecked yet. Had a few close one's but I have babied her and she has treated me well. Would I recommend it to someone else? Maybe...it really depends on the person.

I have made it hard on myself by straping 170HP between my legs. It takes more self control and patience to learn on a 1000 on the street let alone on the track...

I feal I have come along way in the 3 months of track and racing I have done.....

:)


20 I's in one post I thought there was a limit to that.:popcorn
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,269 Posts
smokenjoe said:
20 I's in one post I thought there was a limit to that.:popcorn
:bitchslap

Yep...That is why there is one member in Team Simone Racing...It's all about me... :rolleyes

Why don't you just really say what's on your mind.. :idea
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
extrakt0r said:
Why don't you just really say what's on your mind.. :idea


I thought I did :spank
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,269 Posts
smokenjoe said:
I thought I did :spank
Just want to make sure you get all that sand and your bloody tampon all the way out of your vagina... :blowingup
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
extrakt0r said:
Just want to make sure you get all that sand and your bloody tampon all the way out of your vagina... :blowingup

Hmmm projecting again not a good sign I was not the one that got pissy when presented with a reality that someone did not like.
 

·
Combat Marshmellow
Joined
·
13,132 Posts
damn and all this time i thought joe and brandy were together.... when did you 2 get married.... :gheyfight



just trying to lighten things up a lil.... :beer
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
Alllll righty then one more post derailed. To bad people cant just ride for fun or the love of riding
It doesnt make you an idot or a looser if you do.

Mike seriously do you have any idea how much more money you have to spend on racing than most people. It really does come down to "am I going to eat or am I going to save money to go to the track" sometimes. If you had ever ridden on the track without a HP andvantage and more mony in trick parts on your bike thatn my entire bike costs your comments about not needing mony to be compeditive would go over much more gracefully. I really dont know where you are comming from there how did you come to that conclusion?
 

·
You will be missed Shawn
Joined
·
6,508 Posts
to some extent I do have to agree w/all the posts thus far.
First, BG, they are not married and have no intention of it!

Second, it does cost money. Some of us work 2 jobs in order to afford to take a 5 year old bike w/o great suspention and a basically stock engine to the track 1 time a month. And still are unable to afford to go.

Third, having the best and latest/greatest and all teh trick parts will NOT make you the fastest guy out there...you are correct. BUT, it certainly doesnt' hurt either to have a HUGE hp advantage.
And it does make it easier to use all that hp/trick parts to beat the other guy hands down that do not have the same advantage. Forget about spending 10k on an engine. if you spend 3k on suspension, you can get buy w/o spending so much on an engine and just use what you got.

Foruth, I like to win. I like to ride. I like to race. What I don't like is getting my ass handed to me every friggin time I'm out there...and before anyone else says anything, I also realize the problem is not the bike, but the rider (lack of the abilitiy to turn the right wrist in the correct position). And before any thing else gets said about my R1, I am absolutely NOT selling it for a 600. I would rather get my ass handed to me before I sell it.


You know, at HPT, I also realized a few things. The very last race, I was thisclose to throwing in the towel and saying fuck it, I'm done. I"m slow as fuck, and have no chance at all w/competing w/these guys. I'm done racing and am going back to track days.

do I still feel this way? hell yes. Am I going to quit altoghther? no. I still have Barber coming up. And here is the deal. I will either get faster...or crash trying. One of the two. I know Barber better than MAM I think, i can walk thru the corners in my head, I KNOW that track.

After Barber? yeah, I"m done for this year. Maybe next year if I can pick up a cheap 600 I will race again. maybe not. But I do know, I was not enjoying myself on a couple of races at HPT, and that is a big red flag to me. If I am not enjoying it, I shouldnt' be doing it. I had more fun in practice than anything else. That shouldn't be. Maybe you are right MIke, maybe my mentatility wasn't where it should have been (i.e treating practice and racing different). However, I do know that my lap times picked up as the day progressed (go figure) and I did no suspension adjustments other than dropping my rear preload 1 notch. Maybe I'm not in tune for my bike...who knows.

good healthy debate and discussion is good...kudos to Joe for starting a good topic. Kudos to mike for contributing to it. :bitchslap to both of you for antangonizing the other though. keep it civil.
 
1 - 20 of 76 Posts
Top