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Discussion Starter #21 (Edited)
If you have specific questions PM me a number and I will call you back and try and answer them. If you were closer I'd offer to lend a hand (hey, look for a cheap flight from HSV,AL to CA! LOL)

Print out this and the BARF forum thread, and highlight or markup on each what the questions are, then we can discuss if you want.

I'm no mechanic, but I am cheap (I save so I can buy more bikes LOL) so I try and fix my own stuff. I got frustrated, but at no time did I feel it was over my head. I would have liked an extra set of hands though. Just don't rush it. You'll have to do it again in 8k or so miles, may as well learn how to do it and make it part of the routine maintenance.
 

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To anyone claiming they didnt need to adjust any, or doing it in under 3 hours---you obviously skiiped all the other steps of the "tune-up". I work on bikes for a living (30+ years now) and I routinely spend 7+ hours on every shim under bucket bike for a "tune-up"--but then again I am a picky f*ck and demand perfection with all my adjustments.
Oh and I have over 13,000 shims on hand ( every shim in every size, so .25mm increments--now thats perfection) for adjusting valves, and I use a micrometer on each and every job. And when the oems say you can go 26,000 miles before your first service---thats right, it will run that long, just at a diminished performance level and creating excess wear on all the engine parts. But hey how else are they going to sell you that new bike for way too much. Lie to you and say look what you are saving on the service, thats how, then when you actually follow there service "guideline" you will be buying a new bike, because your old one isn't running as good as it should, or as it once did...But hey the degradation of performance is gradual, you'll never even notice, until you ride something new, or one that has been "properly" maintained.
But what do I know ? I've only sent some of the nations best to every racetrack and made every customers bike run better than it ever did, even off the show floor.
 

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And when the oems say you can go 26,000 miles before your first service---thats right, it will run that long, just at a diminished performance level and creating excess wear on all the engine parts.
I'm not following you on that one. On my last bike the first valve check was at 26,600mi. and all the clearances were where they needed to be. I don't see how there could have possibly been any diminished performance. And I ran that bike pretty hard too.
 

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Must be nice to live in your fantasy world. You must have the only bike ever mass produced that the valves arent moving on, or didn't need adjustment. Or they have moved tighter and looser over those 26,000 miles and somehow are within "tolerance" at the moment you checked them.
" all the clearances were where they needed to be" really and what would that be---within the .003"-.004" tolerance they say is acceptable. Thats a joke. So you have some valves at .0051 and some at .0079 on the intake--and some at .0091 and some at .0118 on the exhuast. Thats just simply too much variance and too big of a range to have your bike running as smooth as it should or could.
The "go- no go" mentality of checking valve clearances is totally idiotic. You wont find the "tuners" doing this, just the hacks.

Look, good for you if you have a bike that runs to your standard of "good". I think you'd be amazed at what my standard of "good" is, you would bow down and kiss my feet, if your bike ran to my standard of good. I am just that picky---tolerances are for mass producing, not for fine tuning- this goes for the valve clearances, the throttle body/ carb synchronization, the TPS adjustment and all the other sensors and senders that have a "tolerance". Unfortunately not all of them on every bike are adjustable, but the can be "fooled" into adjustment.
Did you bother checking oil pressure, cylinder compression, cylinder leakage, cam lobe hieghts, cam to cam cap clearance or anything else?

Not busting your balls, but this is the mentality that has been driven into joe blow public and the stealership wrenches that pisses me off...so uninformed/ misinformed!
 

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Reference me to some info. I would like to look into what you are saying.
 

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This is all my experience---what materials am I supposed to reference you to?
I am not about to pull out 30 years of tedious notes and thousands and thousands of valve clearance measurements, and waste my time trying to "educate" you to how things really are.
You can either believe me or not.
The last bike I just did yesterday---2004 Kaw 636 19,276 ( it isnt scheduled for valve adjustment til 26,000) and supposedly a local stealership had just done a "tune up" on this bike at 14,000 miles--- it came in because it ran no better after she picked it up than it did when she took it in to them. The TPS and throttle body sync were off--as well as many other things "they" didnt do.
intakes
.0035 .004 .0045 .0055 .0035 .004 .005 .004
exhuasts
.0010 .0085 .007 .0085 .0095 .006 .0065 .0075

This is how it came in!!

A couple days ago I did a Triumph sprint 1050 (3 cylinder) 8645 miles ( It isnt scheduled for a valve adjustment til 12,000

intakes
.0035 .005 .007 .0055 .0045 .006
exhuasts
.0075 .0085 .009 .010 .0105 .008
 

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Sorry, just wanted some info. I'll look into it further on my own.
 

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Look I am sure you already formed your opinion of me, as an asshole orwhatever.
I only state facts that I personally have experienced, and I am not about to do all the research for everyone else---I waste more than enough time trying to educate my own customers---I dont need to do it on the forums as well.
I put good information out there, what you want to do with it is up to you.

You can read online about anything, and there will always be a dozen opinions and views---so you no doubt can find whatever answer you want to find, and then justify your own beliefs.
On the internet, under the giese of anonimity, alot of people just make statements based upon what they heard from a friend who had a friend who heard from a mechanic somewhere that this is what is "normal" or this is the case, or whatever----second, third and fourth hand information is bullshit at best. Or what they read on the internet somewhere--you decide which is worse. No information is better than bullshit information.
Most of what is read on these forums is just something reposted from another forum, from another article, from hearsay---not from real knowledgable first hand experience.
The trick is to know what is verifiable fact and what is only partly fact.
If I come down on you for asking me to do all your "legwork" its because it is insulting and a waste of my time. I did all the legwork---30+ years of hard work and research. I share some of the knowledge with my customers and on my website--and some I keep strictly for me . And when scrutinized or questioned--without anything to support your questioning (aside from the fact you have no idea who I am) then why do I want to continue trying to "help"..There is no incentive, no "good" feeling, no upside for me--just frustration that another unknowledgable person who hasnt put in their own legwork dares to question my findings.
Look for yourself, my screen name is the same on over a dozen forums, it wont be hard to find. And when you are done---go and search for answers to all your questions and see who else is posting up any good information on real world stuff like experience with valve clearances etc...
 

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No problem. You inspired me to look into it is all. Thanks for the info that you did share.

You did have me curious on how often to check and if you adjust closer or farther or use some sort of average. I'm sure with your 30+ years of working on bikes that you in fact are knowledgeable. I don't claim to know it all and that is one of the reasons that I look for information on forums just like these. I also know that there is good and bad info and don't tend to believe everything that I hear. I wouldn't mind knowing how to eek out a little more HP on my machine.
 

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No skin off my nose. There is alot of good info floating around out there. Just wondered if you knew where there were reputable ones.
 

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I have at least 20 hours tied up in the job, and I will never do it again. I'll pay someone to do it or trade the bike first. Kudos to the engineers for making the whole ordeal extra painful...
I will be checking my valve clearance very soon, Hopefully after i have my new GSXR750 so i have something to ride if i don't get it done in one day. A second pair of hands should speed up the process. 28k miles on bike.
 

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just did this on my bike 8500 miles, had to adjust ALL of the exhaust valves, and 2 of the intake valves (they were on the same cylinder). Love the write up made it 1000 times easier. Take your time if doing this, and make sure to get those cams lined back up correctly (this alone took me an hour). Bike runs so much better now, and sounds different, Louder, in a good way.
 

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Bringing this one back from the dead. Good info in here. I'm amidst doing one on the 259 and dread doing one on the 600. 8 more valves and more junk to undo than the 250. Yeah, it seems theses bikes are prone to needing the valves adjusted at the required interval. Exhaust valves seem to tighten/go out of spec first compared to the intake valves at the first adjustment.
 

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Discussion Starter #36
Two persons make the job much easier. You have someone to hold tools/cables/hoses for you, and an extra hand to tighten fasteners. IMO, a second set of hands is required to get the cam chain tight and prevent it from slipping a tooth on the cam gear when tightening the journal cap.

I helped Jay with his and it went much easier. I did mine solo, and it took HOURS to get that part right. Too many things to contend with for that step to cope with one set of hands IMO.

I guess I said I would never do it again, but I did....:eek:nfloor
 
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