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Discussion Starter #1
Well considering everyone these days are looking for more stickier compounds and more grip. I was wondering what the most slippery tires you guys as racers have ever dealt with.

The reason I am asking is because I want to learn to control slides without really having to push the limits of the most advanced tires out there (M1's, Corsas etc.)

So what tire would you suggest for practicing slides with some ease? This test will be done at a track so it will be very much a learning expierence.....
 

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You need to get a moto-X bike and go do some dirt tracking, that will give you all kinds of experience. I personally learned about controlled slides on my 3 wheelers I had growing up, you have to ride those alot more like a bike than a four wheeler.

Actually sliding is a bad thing, if your sliding you are going slower than you could be going. Learning to control the throttle when it begins to slide is valuable, but sliding just fries your tires. The only real advantage I can think of is if you need it to get the bike around a corner, which is rare, and would not be a normal situation. :)
 

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The stock tires that came with my 636 (bstone Bt012 or whatever) were really slick compared to the good sport tires these days. I bet if you got some similar hard, all season skins, you could practice spinning it up without pushing quite as hard.
 

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VVVWWVWW said:
Well considering everyone these days are looking for more stickier compounds and more grip. I was wondering what the most slippery tires you guys as racers have ever dealt with.

The reason I am asking is because I want to learn to control slides without really having to push the limits of the most advanced tires out there (M1's, Corsas etc.)

So what tire would you suggest for practicing slides with some ease? This test will be done at a track so it will be very much a learning expierence.....
I can tell you read twist of the wrist 1. :beer That's one thing I don't agree with though. Code suggests that we should start on harder tires and experience some sliding instead of putting very sticky tires. I personally want my tires to always out-perform me!!
 

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I think it's a good idea to start off with harder tires because the limits can be reached at lower speeds and/or with less intense cornering. Same reason you practice on a smaller machine or a dirtbike.
 

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GSXR RACER MIKE said:
You need to get a moto-X bike and go do some dirt tracking, that will give you all kinds of experience. I personally learned about controlled slides on my 3 wheelers I had growing up, you have to ride those alot more like a bike than a four wheeler.

Actually sliding is a bad thing, if your sliding you are going slower than you could be going. Learning to control the throttle when it begins to slide is valuable, but sliding just fries your tires. The only real advantage I can think of is if you need it to get the bike around a corner, which is rare, and would not be a normal situation. :)

Mike hit it on the head with the throttle control. You should only back it in when absolutely necessary.

Agreed with the dirt track experience. Additionally, trying motard should also lend in what your desired end result seems to be.

:cheers
 

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Discussion Starter #7
I have 2 years of moto X expierence and back end control was the biggest part of it. The thing I was getting at was just learned to get that feeling on a real street bike, not in the dirt..... I have also read TWoW 1 and 2 thank you....The reason I was asking was for out of the corner drive....spinning the rear out of the corner is according to Keith Code showing you are accelarating as hard as possible...correct me if im wrong... Thanks for the advice guys keep it coming.
 

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I found that the tires that came stock on the 2004 R1, which are the Bridgestone 2182, made for very cool and controllable rear tire slides accelerating out of corners while at a couple of track days. They are a bit slippery.
 

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VVVWWVWW said:
The reason I was asking was for out of the corner drive....spinning the rear out of the corner is according to Keith Code showing you are accelarating as hard as possible...correct me if im wrong... Thanks for the advice guys keep it coming.
The 1st question I have is are you to the point of having to wring the last ounce of acceleration out of your bike yet? Are you a Road Racer yourself already? The Pro's that are doing this are on bike's with more power than we're using as Regional racers and have a supply of tires that they don't have to pay for themselves. The rubber left on the pavement, that TT mentioned, is proof of your tire bill going up quickly because it's no longer attached to your tires. I personally know an instructor who would probably argue against tire spinning as being a wanted thing, he is huge into suspension set-up and being able to put power to the ground to provide forward acceleration, he is also 1 of the fastest racers in the Midwest.

Tire expenses are probably the single most influential factor in regional racers only lasting an average of 2 - 3 seasons before quiting due to massive debt being the usual culprit. Currently I have been seeing many front running Experts, and even front running Amateurs, that are buying/using tires at alarming rates that has been very effective in driving costs to race competitively at regional events to over $1000 per event (with tire costs comprising almost 2/3 to 3/4 of that cost)! Anything you can do to make your tires last longer would be very beneficial to you.

Having said that I will tell you the route I personally took. I started racing in 1996 without ever having been on a racetrack in my life and not knowing anyone in racing at all, I also undertook this experience completely on my own always going to the races alone. I started back then on street tires that had no where near the traction that they have now, the limit of those tires was quickly achieved on the track. I then switched to an intermediate race tire which was good for the rest of my 1st season. My 2nd season I switched to a full race D.O.T. tire which was the best available to regional racers. In my experience racing on slippery tires develops an ability to deal with them, but to the opposite extreme it can also develop a distrust in pushing your tires harder than where you previously experienced slip at when you again have good tires. Also is the difference in the way that street tires, intermediate street/race tires, and full race tires act at their traction limits.

I remember that Michilin's previous generation of tires were notorious for going from great traction to no traction once crossing the traction threshold. I have heard that their latest generation of tires are much better in this regard, but they definately need tire warmers to get them up to operating temperature due to having low traction when not hot. I have only used Dunlop's the entire time I have raced, the nice thing with them is that I have had great experience with them when cold, hot, and heavily worn. I like the way that Dunlop's have been predictable for me when reaching their traction limit, they have a tendency to fade away at a recoverable rate instead of fall away suddenly. I think the bad thing about practicing with a lower traction street tire is the break away traction loss point and how the tire acts at and after that point. I think a better approach to practice with sliding, if your so inclined, is to purchase some race take-offs from racers using the type(s) of tire(s) your looking to push to their absolute limit of traction. This would be a relatively cheap way to purchase tires that will eventually slip, but will do so at a rate and consistency that is representative of a true race tire.

Good luck if you choose to do this, and keep the tires on the pavement! :)
 
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