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RADIAL MOUNT CALIPERS; what’s all the hubbub, Bub?

Interesting how things that oftentimes appear to be a radical departure from the “norm” are in fact evolutionary rather than a genuine fundamental revolution. The new buzz on Radial Mount Calipers is straight from the automotive industry with a few minor tweaks. With cars, they’ve almost always mounted the calipers in a fore and aft manner because it’s a straight up simple and strong way to do so. Granted, the new motorcycle version has finally taken that lead and adapted the concept by incorporating a radial mount instead of the commonplace perpendicular (90 degree to rotor face axis) mounting bosses universally prevalent today. In reality, whether calipers are mounted radially or perpendicularly is of little consequence, having only to do with the fact that the new generation calipers can be made a bit lighter via the radial mount set-up (no other significant performance difference here).

I know I’m going to disappoint more than a few technophiles here by stating the Radial Mount design in and of itself offers no real world performance gains beyond improved pad wear characteristics, and that is almost strictly focused on the near elimination of TORSIONAL caliper flex. Bear in mind and heretofore, all conventional calipers are mounted at the trailing edge of the line of force, combined with the fact the energy transfer (to the forks) of the braking forces are all focused on just one side of the clamping pressure as applied to the spinning rotor. Then factor in the normal production tolerances between the mounting faces of the rotor/wheel, fork/caliper, plus perpendicular axle alignment within the wheel to these faces, and more. Of course we can stir the pot with greater possibilities for misalignment with (even just slightly) out of true axles and fork tubes. The end result is there’s always some degree of mating issues that ultimately effect performance potential yet are still within factory tolerance. Depending on degree of misalignment, a torsional twisting effect of the caliper can come into play during hard braking. This usually manifests itself with radial tapered (bottom to top) pad wear, brake howl and piston retraction problems due to this distortion. The relatively new radial mount caliper design virtually eliminates this torsion flex problem since it more efficiently spreads the load both fore and aft to the line of force. It also offers the additional advantage of better (quicker) release at the end of the braking sequence (FYI: brake pad compounds play a large part here, too). Which from the racing perspective provides a cleaner transition when braking into the apex on the edge of disaster. This is a very good thing indeed. But again, something you the average weekend warrior will not likely feel at the lever.

As a sidebar, the single action calipers (live pistons on one side only) such as what came on the CBR600F3 (and is standard on virtually all Motocross bikes) have categorically fallen out of favor for use on Sportbikes. This is primarily due to the fact they suffer from unavoidably greater degrees of flex inherent in the calipers floating pin design and minimal piston area (compared to the modern double action calipers).

The Real World of Greater Performance:
Here’s where it really gets interesting: incorporated into the design of the new generation Radial Mount Calipers is the latest in braking technology led by two basic concepts. Of course there’s more to it than just this, but in an attempt to keep it simple, the elements can be effectively identified by these two separate yet related categories:
1. CALIPER STIFFNESS
2. BRAKE PAD DESIGN AND THE LEADING EDGE

Caliper Deflection:
The difference in deflection between the O.E. calipers and the dedicated racing caliper is remarkably quite large. Rigidity plays a major role here. And there’s also a surprising difference between the various O.E. manufacturers in this critical area of stiffness. Bear in mind that on a World Supersport spec heavy braker, we found vertical (up to down) pad taper, just a tenth of mm (.004”) but this is clearly representative of an existing problem. Under severe conditions, caliper deflection is manifest as either inconsistent braking performance and/or a somewhat vague feel at the brake lever. Other factors such as fluid integrity, i.e. relative to water saturation point and resultant resistance to fluid boil (wet vs. dry boiling point), plus backplate flatness and to a lesser extent, friction material compressibility all play a significant role here, too. This is clearly demonstrated on the research dyno where simply changing calipers on the test fixture (with same compound pad and rotor) equates to sometimes dramatically different friction level curves. This is much more pronounced with O.E. calipers than the high-end billet racing counter-parts…but in all fairness, the production O.E. calipers still do a very good job overall, particularly when cost is factored in.

Another fundamental and crucial difference here is with material and manufacturing techniques. Production machines invariably use mass produced cast calipers versus the race-bred gems found in SBK & MotoGP. Those are the real beauties, CNC machined from substantially higher tensile strength billet stock and often sporting ventilated Titanium pistons. The differences are again manifold but paramount is superior rigidity combined with a typically longer and narrower pad shape. The Narrow Track layout focuses the applied braking pressure over a somewhat smaller area, optimizing [in microseconds] the reaction time of the braking forces. Of course another advantage of the race specific calipers is their lighter weight due in large part again to the higher psi capabilities of the premium grade billet material.

With cost always an issue with production bikes; brake designers went back to the drawing boards to boost performance while keeping a bean counters check on cost considerations.

Brembo again forged the way forward with the introduction in late 2000 of their stunning Four Pad caliper, which found a home in both the Aprilia Mille and the Ducati 748 and 998 R models. These were the first of their kind using the individual pad per piston design in a mass produced production caliper. They wisely addressed the performance advantages of increased stiffness with the addition of a massive bridge over the top of the pad cavity opening, greatly increasing resistance to distortion.

PAD DESIGN, the Leading Edge:
The new generation Brembo 4 Piston Caliper design was then further enhanced by incorporating four separate pads operating with larger equal sized 34mm pistons (than their 30/34mm twin pin forerunner). The necessity of using differential bore piston diameters to reduce pad taper (fore and aft) became a moot point when switching to the short individual pad and piston arrangement. Greater piston area mated to a properly sized mastercylinder piston (ratio) improved performance values. But there’s an additional benefit to the individual pad/piston configuration: greater initial bite. Inevitably, as the pads friction material bears down on the rotor during braking, each leading edge acts with greater force than its trailing counterpart, adding additional grip in the process. Think of it in terms of the friction material trying to wedge into the rotor. More leading edges…more bite. Although this is for the most part noticeable mainly in the initial braking sequence, but the end result is another notch up the bar in performance levels. This fact is not new having been around in the Aftermarket for years. Companies like ISR, Harrison, PM and others have and continue to offer these in various combinations. Bear in mind however, you the consumer are going to pay for this improved performance with a notably higher pad replacement cost.

And now Tokico has taken this concept another step by incorporating a beautifully sculpted individual pad/piston design into the trick looking radial mount system, debuting on the new 2003 Kawasaki ultra ZX6R/RR and Suzuki with their revised GSX-R1000 assault weapon.

So bottom line, what does it mean to you the Sportbike enthusiast and weekend warrior? In simple terms, it’s stronger brakes. Evidently the O.E.’s think enough so to warrant down sizing the rotors to improve handling and turn-in performance via reduced rotating mass (less gyroscopic forces). It will surely be of interest to all to see how well these smaller, lighter rotors will like this arrangement. Rotors with less material mass and heat sink capability often suffer more from fatal thermal stress distortion.

Does all this new-fangled brake design mean the current crop of high performance calipers are making a quick exodus to the dust-bins? Not likely. Need proof? The 2002 World Superbike Champion Colin Edwards and the mighty Honda VTR1000Sp2 used the traditional Nissin 6 pot billet race caliper all season…Old World perpendicular mount and all. Could it be Honda was too cheap to fork over the cash for the latest radial mount version? Yeah, right! Sure looked to me like the new Champs brakes were working just fine…


http://www.ferodobraketech.com/tech/radial1.html
 

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O.K. I got to about the fourth line in paragraph 2 and was lost, 1 of 2 things you are an person with an IQ of 190 or you have way to much time reading books with out motorcycles in them. Thanks for the info I could understand, kept asking what the difference was with radial mount brakes.
 

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The really funny thing is that one of downsides to radial calipers has nothing to do with any change in braking capabilites. The thing I don't care for is how they very difficult to remove quickly (like for an endurance race bike front tire change) because the caliper mounting bolts now face to the rear of the bike instead of outward, naking it virtually impossible to get an impact on them.
 

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Stoped reading afet the first paragraph Radial brakes rock- tested many of both. Theory means nothing compaired to real world.
 
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I was lost reading that but, I agree they don't make any difference in the real world.
I don't have any trouble getting to the bolts and would never use impact wrenches on the soft parts (aluminum) of my bikes.
 

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I will tell ya you can feel the the radial calpers on the track but on the street you cant tell one from the other only cuz on the track you are going much faster and the the bumps and dips and not even close to what the street has EX= rain rumples,filled pot holes ,cracks crap like that. more or less if your just on the street and you want better brakes get better pads.[/COLOR][/FON :neener T]
 

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There are many people who will disagree with this.
 
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ok so why did you all have trouble following that? nvm... it doesn't matter.

Brakes work on a simple principle of converting kinetic energy into heat by way of friction. More friction equals more heat however the calipers and fluids can only handle so much heat before they begin to "soften". Brake fluid is designed to have a particular compression modulus but as the temperature rises this modulus decreases allowing the fluid to be compressed farther. By using aluminium the calipers can disperse more heat while weighing less. The faster the heat can be dispersed the more heat the pads and calipers can absorb and the lower the fluid temperature stays. How the brakes are mounted to the forks is virtually irrelevant accept to increase the elastic modulus(stress/strain) of the system(less warping parts).

that started out to be a less confusing explanation but I think I made it worse. Oh well, it's 2:42am so my brain isn't in the best of places :drool
 

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This makes perfect sense to me, it's quite often that it's the entire package that matters and not one individual part. I think a lot of people who try to get more performance out of their bike often neglect performance in key areas. But I guess if they have fun doing it, that's all that matters.
 

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We had to wait 8 months for that reply. Thank you very much. This thread just keeps getting the paddles.
 

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So really, what's the dif between radial mount and normal?? And can you tell by looking?

And WTF are "full floating" rotors, and why are they better?
 

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So, for some reason I'm supposed to leave dead threads alone?

Not sure why, when a simple google search lead me directly here, where I found some helpful (if "old") information in the form of a thread.

I'm reviving this thread, then, not to continue the discussion, but for the sake of the curious googler who finds himself landing here.

If you really want to understand brakes, radial or otherwise, go here:

Car Bibles : The Brake Bible

That is all.
 
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