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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
A couple of weeks ago, I ventured out onto the track for the very first time by taking a racing school course (FAST). I had chosen to ride an R6 during that course, I was curious to see just how different it would be from my FZ6.

Wow. What a difference it was. Obviously the body positioning was fundamentally different, though, I have to say I got used to it and I think I'm perfectly fine with a more aggressive riding position -- on the track.

I kind of expected to be able to feel some familiarity with the FZ6. Boy was I wrong. The two engines feel completely differently.

One of the major differences I noticed was throttle response. I always thought the FZ6 is a very responsive bike. However, having been on the R6, I feel like the R6 throttle response was definitely quicker. The bike seemed to respond to throttle inputs instantly, moreso than with the FZ6. Has anyone else made this observation?

Now, on to the next part. What could account for this difference? Could we give our FZ6s better throttle response by remapping our EFI? The R6 I had was outfitted with a Hindle exhaust, my FZ6 (until next week) has stock pipes. Could the aftermarket exhaust on the R6 account for that difference? Anything else?

-Q
 

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This is because the R6 is a race bike out of the box. The FZ6 is a sport touring bike out of the box. We keep rehashing these observations over and over. They are going to be different bikes.
 

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While putting on a good set of aftermarket pipes( scorpions) help, the best way would be to get a Power Commander, K&N filter also.
I have put on all the above and with the Accelerator Pump upgrade from Power Commander website, I notice a great inprovement in response. I also think that it's now smoother in the entire range of RPM's
My 2cents
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Aburke27 said:
This is because the R6 is a race bike out of the box. The FZ6 is a sport touring bike out of the box. We keep rehashing these observations over and over. They are going to be different bikes.
I'm well aware that one is a race bike and one is a sport touring bike. I'm merely asking about one of my observations and what could account for it. EFI, exhaust, or (more likely?) the other tuning changes to the engine.

If I had wanted an R6, I would've bought one :) I wanted an FZ6 and am happy with it. I obviously missed all the other threads where this was rehashed over and over and was sharing my observation and curious about some feedback :)

Cheers,
-Q
 

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Well I just picked up a really clean 99 honda cbr 900RR and wow it makes my fz6 feel like a brick in all meanings of the term. The throttle response is great the engine is alittle more buzzy but it might be the two brothers slipon. All in all I respect the two bikes each one has there intended purposes. I love the fz6 and will probably keep it as it is so much fun. But it is nice to have a bike like the 900rr for track days.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
j-man said:
While putting on a good set of aftermarket pipes( scorpions) help, the best way would be to get a Power Commander, K&N filter also.
I have put on all the above and with the Accelerator Pump upgrade from Power Commander website, I notice a great inprovement in response. I also think that it's now smoother in the entire range of RPM's
My 2cents
Thanks for the feedback. I suspected this might be one of the things that might help. Whether or not that's somethign I'd want to consider in the future, we'll see. Spending way too much on the new pipes, FE kit, etc right now as it is ;)
 

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The R6 also has LARGER throttle bodies than the FZ6. It's going to pump in more fuel and give you better response.
 

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qualdoth said:
A couple of weeks ago, I ventured out onto the track for the very first time by taking a racing school course (FAST). I had chosen to ride an R6 during that course, I was curious to see just how different it would be from my FZ6.

Wow. What a difference it was. Obviously the body positioning was fundamentally different, though, I have to say I got used to it and I think I'm perfectly fine with a more aggressive riding position -- on the track.

I kind of expected to be able to feel some familiarity with the FZ6. Boy was I wrong. The two engines feel completely differently.

One of the major differences I noticed was throttle response. I always thought the FZ6 is a very responsive bike. However, having been on the R6, I feel like the R6 throttle response was definitely quicker. The bike seemed to respond to throttle inputs instantly, moreso than with the FZ6. Has anyone else made this observation?

Now, on to the next part. What could account for this difference? Could we give our FZ6s better throttle response by remapping our EFI? The R6 I had was outfitted with a Hindle exhaust, my FZ6 (until next week) has stock pipes. Could the aftermarket exhaust on the R6 account for that difference? Anything else?

-Q
Just change your sprockets (smaller front/larger rear) and you'll be surprised at how much more torque you get at the rear wheel.
 

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The R6 has a different injection system, cam profile and ignition system and higher compression. Althought the engines are basically the same, those three factors would add up to a very different machine. I'd guess the injection alone would be the most obvious point for throttle response, although the compression and cam definitely help that along.
 

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I would presume throttle response "should" correspond to bike acceleration. (Maybe not exactly).

The two bikes have almost the same Torque-Rpm curves. It is merely that the R6 has a higher redline, so it can offer higher Hp at the top end. This gives it a higher top speed, but does not affect acceleration of itself.

The R6 is lighter at 391 lbs versus FZ6's porkish 426 lbs. Add in a rider weight of 185 lbs (me), makes the [R6 & rider] to be 6% lighter than the FZ6. Since [acceleration]=[torque]/[weight], then the R6 should offer 6% faster acceleration. You don't think it helps GP champion Valentino Rossi that he is only 130 lbs, and Marco Medandri is 134. You want to go fast? Go on a diet!

But there is more, the R6 has lower gearing than the FZ6. The final drive on the R6 has a ratio of 2.875, while the FZ6 is taller at 3.000. This gives a difference in torque of 4%.

Weight advantage of R6/FZ6 = 1.06
Gearing advantage of R6/FZ6 = 1.04
Combined advantage of R6/FZ6 = 1.10

This makes the R6 grab 10% faster acceleration over the FZ6.

Last, the FZ6 has group fuel injection. Makes for simpler and cheaper construction, but offers less balanced distribution of mixture to cylinders.

Some of the other difference with the R6 engine doesn't give faster response, rather it allows the engine to run up to a higher redline. That does not give acceleration, just higher top end speed to each gear - and helps win the race. Such things are a different cam profile, harder springs, b***** throttle bodies, or dual injectors.

Of course, on a track you got to also deliver the power. So suspension and rubber helps, but only if the grip is otherwise slipping.

Lesson learned:
- Drop in shorter gears on the drive train.
- Go on a diet.
- Don't race with a tail bag, etc.

Also. Sometimes a backpressure on the headers help or hinders but this depends on the valve timing. As such, a louder muffler (less pressure) can help while on other configurations it can hinder it. With a different muffler, a new EFI mapping is often called for. From what I have read, a different muffler will affect power levels by only a small margin (2-3%) at best.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Thank you all for all your comments. I've definitely learned a lot more about the differences between the engines, especially when it comes to fuel injection.

-Q
 

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I like rehashing topics, not all the topics but topics like these are fun to talk about. It allows some of the newer guys that have different opinions on the subject that haven't posted on the other rehashed topics to allow their input. I mean there only so much we can talk about our bikes. If we never rehashed things, this forum would be just a bunch of stickies.
 
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