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Discussion Starter #1
In a spectacularly small minded act, Jeff Sessions fired Andy McCabe hours before he became eligible for his retirement package. Clearly Sessions did it on the orders of Trump, who no doubt threatened Sessions with his own job security if he didn't fire McCabe, a 21-year FBI career man.

Mr. McCabe was the F.B.I.’s second in command during one of the most tumultuous periods in the bureau’s history. He oversaw investigations into both the Trump campaign and Hillary Clinton’s use of a private email server — and he dealt with the fallout from both. He became the acting F.B.I. director after the sudden firing of his boss, Mr. Comey, and he publicly contradicted the White House on national television over whether Mr. Comey had lost the support of rank-and-file F.B.I. agents.

Since then, Mr. Trump has repeatedly singled him out for public attack, suggesting that he helped protect Mrs. Clinton from prosecution during the 2016 presidential campaign. As evidence, he pointed to the fact that Mr. McCabe’s wife, Jill, ran as a Democrat for a State Senate seat in Virginia and received hundreds of thousands of dollars from a political committee run by Terry McAuliffe, a longtime ally of the Clintons.
- NYT

Wow! You wonder how much worse this can get. Except, it can. Mueller's probably next.

Getting rid of Mueller may be the prime inflection point as to what kind of country we are. As it is, we are at a point wherein the POTUS is completely unfit and is supported by a GOP Congress which has lost its way over the years and kneels in complete subjugation to a sociopathic man-child.
 

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I think Trump is clearing a path to fire Mueller. Firing McCabe should be an indication of having the DOJ and FBI in Trumps control. The GOP just shut down their investigation. If Trump fires Mueller, I don’t think there is a mechanism in government to provide any oversite. The last line of oversite is the house and Senate. If the Dems don’t take both house and Senate in November there’s nothing to stop Trump from doing what ever he wants to do.
 

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I would be surprised if that would be it. Sessions would have to fire Rothstein, which he has shown no sign of doing. That's first. Second, we don't know what kinds of things the Grand Jury already has. Fire Mueller and the Grand Jury might immediately drop a bunch of bombs. Third, there are both federal and state charges against Gates and Manafort. I could be wrong, but I don't believe Trump can pardon those guys of state charges. Firing Mueller and then pardoning them would cause all kinds of ongoing issues. Fourth, if this all goes down, the chances that the GOP holds the House get smaller, and the chances that an independent special prosecutor gets set up in early 2019 just go to 100%. Trump is dumb enough and short sighted enough to risk all of it for a quick applause line and a quick respite. I'm not sure the rest of his administration is quite as stupid as he is.

One final thought. The Senate is not the House, and the Senate committee hasn't done a hasty memo proclaiming that Trump is just fine and ducky. Trump doesn't have the same number of devout adherents in the Senate that he does in the House, because Senators don't have the same luxury of representing a narrow, gerrymandered district. They have entire states to deal with, and the chances of getting turfed, whether in a primary or general election, are higher for them if they aren't at least making an appearance of being reasonable and patriotic. Devin Nunes doesn't give a shit if he's a traitor to the nation so long as he's loyal to Trump. Somebody like Lindsay Graham, as much as I don't agree with him, is a different breed. Same with John McCain. Trump won't get the slavish loyalty from the Senate Republicans, which means the investigations will continue there, no matter what Trump or the House do. This is another place where Trump may be an idiot, but Kelly isn't. As soon as Trump fires Kelly, who knows what might happen. Kelly is another one I don't care for, but who has a certain amount of intelligence and who is not blindly loyal to Trump and the GOP before his country. At least I hope so.

Plus, then there's the ongoing bimbo eruptions. Those are a sideshow until it turns out that Trump was paying hush money while POTUS and was involved in threatening people. He has always liked making threats, and that behavior could be his undoing in the end.

Get out the popcorn.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
The New York (and other) state investigations will continue even if he gaffs Rosenstein and (therefore) Mueller. I'd like to know what happens to the information he's gathered so far if Mueller does get the boot. Do We the People ever get to see it?

We're getting closer to the midterms with new each day. And Mueller has now breached the gates of the Trump Organization in asking for company information. Those two facts may push Trump over the edge and get rid of Rosenstein and Sessions so he can get some yes man to do the firings.

I don't think the Senate will do much, despite Graham's claim it'll end the administration. It won't. McConnell runs that show, at least possibly till January 1st, 2019. A shitpot full of damage can be done with the remaining 8 months of the year. The one thing that a Mueller firing will accomplish is to further energize the voters who are pretty much fed up with Trump and his dysfunctional administration. This unelected Trump now keeps upping the ante.

Every day some new revelation or some new outrage. Today, I read the safeguards put in place after the Deepwater Horizon accident in the gulf are being lifted by Zinke.

The one constant fact which rings like a fire alarm in my head is that this president lost the popular election by 3 million votes and won the election thanks to an antiquated Constitutional paragraph which essentially reveals that the framers didn't trust We the People to vote "correctly," just as they didn't trust white men without property, women, or slaves.

The electoral college is to blame for the Trump phenomenon. And the wrong guy was "elected" 5 times now. (J.Q. Adams, Hayes, Harrison, Bush 43 and Trump) There is no reason on earth to keep the Electoral College other than it gives a minority party undue power.
 

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Changing the subject back to Mueller and firings. It's pretty clear that Trump is going berserk in the White House, and his handlers are doing what they can to keep a lid on him. Twitter is how he gets around this and throws the tantrum he wants to throw, nasty baby that he is.

So, if he fires Sessions, then fires Rothstein, it means somebody else will be up. That person will either have to fire Mueller without having a handle on the investigation, refuse to fire Mueller and probably get fired, or resign. We have already had one resignation by a Justice employee who didn't want to be in that position. I'm unconvinced that the rank and file would go along with Trump's tantrums for the most part.

Another possibility would be leaks. Mueller is outstandingly good at keeping mum. If he was fired, then there might be occasion for less circumspect people to make sure information got out. It is only a possibility. But, it's one that the House and Senate GOP certainly must be aware of. Their worst nightmare would be to have Trump throw a tantrum and fire lots of people, cover for him, and then have their own venality thrown back in their faces when it becomes clear that they were in on a coverup.

Trump's behavior is the behavior of a guilty person with no self-control. If there was no problem, he would be as serene about it as Obama was over all of the investigations Darryl Issa piddled around with.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Anyone at a lower level than Rosenstein is a Justice Department "lifer." It's arguable that there is no one who would do the deed, once Rosenstein is let go or resigns rather than fire Mueller. (Remember Elliot Richardson?) Sessions, at this point, is recused and can't do anything, at least openly. Trump, I suppose, could threaten the top two guys with their jobs but could they just flip Trump off and take a powder anyway, leaving Justice with no real leader? Possibly. Seems to me he would need a new AG to get the deed done. It's possible our little AG gnome, Jefferson Beauregard Sessions III won't go down without a very public fight.

Trump's in a serious jam here, methinks. Couple all this Mueller stuff with the pussy grabbing, the porn stars and playmates, the non-stop bullshit leaking from his mouth and fingers and I doubt he's got many true believers who'll go to bat for him when the chips are really down.
 

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It's the craven enablers who are afraid of the 40% of Americans who haven't figured out that Trump isn't worth much that are the problem. Meaning people like Paul Ryan and Mitch McConnell. When those two guys grow a spine, then Trump has a problem. Until then, Trump has some cover, whether it's good for the nation or not.
 

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McCabe should be in handcuffs. Leaking protected data/info; then lying to the FBI about it?
OH right, it's only a crime if a conservo does it, right.

Mule Hole is WAY too partisan to be doing what he's doing, period.
 

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Mueller is a Republican and a former Bush appointee. Despite the giant cheeto's insistence, Mueller is not a Democrat and never has been. Neither is Comey, but that's water under the bridge. The problem the giant orange guppy has with Mueller is that he's too non-partisan. He's not a Trump sycophant and won't roll over.

I don't know what McCabe did specifically, but maybe he needed to be canned. If so, it should have happened long ago, not just days before he retires. That's just lousy work by the Trump administration for the last year. Other than that, his firing and the response seems like a side show.

Once again, K5awankya proves he doesn't have an inkling of what he's talking about.
 

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McConnell might have a spine. The proof will be when Trump tries to fire Mueller. Then McConnell may decide that Congress should have done just a bit more to keep that from happening. He says Mueller doesn't need special protections from being fired. McConnell's words are different from others who have decided that he's somehow an undercover "hardened" Democrat.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
McCabe should be in handcuffs. Leaking protected data/info; then lying to the FBI about it?
OH right, it's only a crime if a conservo does it, right.

Mule Hole is WAY too partisan to be doing what he's doing, period.
:eek:nfloor Really? Well, I guess that settles that. LMFAO.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
McConnell might have a spine. The proof will be when Trump tries to fire Mueller. Then McConnell may decide that Congress should have done just a bit more to keep that from happening. He says Mueller doesn't need special protections from being fired. McConnell's words are different from others who have decided that he's somehow an undercover "hardened" Democrat.
I've come to the conclusion that McConnell will do whatever he can....right or wrong...to pack the federal judicial system with his kind of people. That is what that dickwad is all about. He's as cynical as it gets in that respect. That'll be what he crows about the day he leaves the Senate. He "fixed" the courts.
 

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I've come to the conclusion that McConnell will do whatever he can....right or wrong...to pack the federal judicial system with his kind of people. That is what that dickwad is all about. He's as cynical as it gets in that respect. That'll be what he crows about the day he leaves the Senate. He "fixed" the courts.
That's why the GOP overall are protecting him. They want the courts to reflect their monarchist views. It's also why the Evangelical right wing is willing to put up with Trump. They also want to see the courts packed with right wingers. There was an interesting article in the Atlantic, written by Michael Gerson. He's hardly a leftie, and he grew up Evangelical. It's worth a read. He states, although I don't know where he got the information, that the average white Evangelical gets more information from Fox News and talk radio than from the Bible. It's hardly a surprise to me. They have completely strayed from anything remotely resembling Christianity and are worshiping at the altars of false prophets these days.
 

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The plot thickens. I'm amazed that Trump hasn't fired the entire Justice Department and FBI by now. However, I doubt there's much he can do to stop all the investigations at this point. He can pardon people and fire people. But the cat's out of the bag now. The federal judiciary has decided his lawyer was in on criminal activity, and the case is being pursued by a prosecutor's office headed by a Giuliani associate who was appointed by Trump himself. The evidence of criminality must be crystal clear.

There's not enough popcorn.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
The plot thickens. I'm amazed that Trump hasn't fired the entire Justice Department and FBI by now. However, I doubt there's much he can do to stop all the investigations at this point. He can pardon people and fire people. But the cat's out of the bag now. The federal judiciary has decided his lawyer was in on criminal activity, and the case is being pursued by a prosecutor's office headed by a Giuliani associate who was appointed by Trump himself. The evidence of criminality must be crystal clear.

There's not enough popcorn.
I dispensed with the popcorn and replaced it with.....scotch. Popcorn's bad for my digestion. :wink:

Thing's just get "curiouser and curiouser."

At the White House, Trump Takes Selfies and Seethes Over Mueller


Adding insult to injury, Cohen's law firm cuts him loose.

After FBI Raid, Squire Says It Severed Ties to Trump Lawyer Michael Cohen
 
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