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F-You and Yourspace!
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On my to take a dump after lunch I grabbed the latest issue of American Motorcyclist off my desk and headed for my second office. I started browsing the pages looking for an interesting article and I found this:

This is an exact quote from the article. It's from a european study called M.A.I.D (Motorcycle Accidents In-depth Study)

"B***** doesn't mean more dangerous
The study found that there was no relationship between the size of a motorcycle's engine and its chance of being in a crash. In fact, bikes in the over-1,000cc catagory were under represented in crashes. In other words, in Europe at least, b***** bikes are less likely to be involved in a crash."

:popcorn
 

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Anti-Hero said:
On my to take a dump after lunch I grabbed the latest issue of American Motorcyclist off my desk and headed for my second office. I started browsing the pages looking for an interesting article and I found this:

This is an exact quote from the article. It's from a european study called M.A.I.D (Motorcycle Accidents In-depth Study)

"B***** doesn't mean more dangerous
The study found that there was no relationship between the size of a motorcycle's engine and its chance of being in a crash. In fact, bikes in the over-1,000cc catagory were under represented in crashes. In other words, in Europe at least, b***** bikes are less likely to be involved in a crash."

:popcorn
I wouldn't count that as valid because of the number of cruisers and touring bikes that exist ALL over 1000 cc's. I would love to see a study that looks at crash victims (regardless of the circumstance, and see if they have previously registered a motorcycle prior to the crashed bike) and what the age was relative to experience relative to crash percentage.
 

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not to mention europe uses the progressive lisencing system, which means that for someone to have a 1000cc bike they have to have several years of experience.
 

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what R you lookin' at?
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and according to that report 250cc and less are over-represented.......hmmm , maybe it's a bad idea........

or MOST bikes there are 250cc or less.

there are things to be taken from that report. but engine cc's are so far diff. from ours, it's not really usuable.
 

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I don't know how the statistics were used in that study, but I would bet that would be the same in the U.S.

If the "not if but when" theory holds for crashes, of course smaller bikes would be involved more frequently. Just that the severity of the crashes on a slower bike might be less. Also, I would presume that MOST larger, liter bikes are ridden by riders with more experience. Interesting find, either way.
 

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what R you lookin' at?
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seca2r6 said:
I don't know how the statistics were used in that study, but I would bet that would be the same in the U.S.
why would it be the same? they have a tiered licensing system, they HAVE to start on a 50cc bike......when's a rider most likely to crash, intheir 1st yr......guess what they're still riding 50cc's. in the US you get whatever your pocketbook can afford.

how about #'s......how many scooters do you see everyday? not very many....goto to europe and look around, more scooters then cars.....hmm how big are scooter usually......50cc

so the data is great for europe, but not the us. the riding demographics are way different.
 

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How you can even call that close to relevant for us is beyond me. The Euro licensing system is way different than ours (better). No crap there are less accidents on larger bikes over there. You have to have experience to get one. Even over here, most of the experienced people that buy the liter bikes can handle them, the noobs that buy them are the ones that crash.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I'm not saying I agree, or disagree with the study. Nor do I claim it's relevant to the US. I just thought it was interesting.
 

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That quote cant be used to represent the US. European motorcycle training is far supperior, as with their motorcycle laws.

TemtnF8 said:
not to mention europe uses the progressive lisencing system, which means that for someone to have a 1000cc bike they have to have several years of experience.

exactly

Anti-Hero said:
I'm not saying I agree, or disagree with the study. Nor do I claim it's relevant to the US. I just thought it was interesting.
People are forced to start small my law (in most places there) from what ive heard. One can only assume you are just trying to prove someone wrong here
 

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the MAID study is the new definitive study. You can pick it apart based on differences in licensing but its a modern HURT Report and the best data available, internationally.

There is no evidence in available US data that faster bikes have more wrecks. Of course, US data is shitty, but the correlation seems to be between heavier bikes and increased accidents. For example, the biggest cohort is bikes over 1000 ccs. They're all fairly low powered cruisers. Their defining factor is portliness, not power.

The key element of tiered licensing in Europe is letting 14 year olds have low powered bikes. So allowing younger riders to get on bike experience does seem to help. We allow the same thing here in most states.

Edited to add data:

Table 5.3 shows the distribution of engine displacement for the 921 cases. The highest frequency category reported was under 50 cc (42.7% of all cases), followed by b***** PTWs in the 501 to 750 cc category (22.4% of all cases). The large number of under 50cc vehicles was related to the high percentage of L1 vehicles in the MAIDS database. The data indicates that PTWs with engine displacement up to 50 cc accounted for 42% of the accident data and 40% of the exposure data. There was no significant difference between the accident data and the exposure data except for the over 1001 cc category which was found to be under-represented (i.e. had less risk), (chi-square = 6.2, p<.013).
 

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Also are the taking into account all the little vespas running around Europe? if so you are over representing the 600cc and under class as well...
 

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TemtnF8 said:
not to mention europe uses the progressive lisencing system, which means that for someone to have a 1000cc bike they have to have several years of experience.
+100000000 :cheers
 

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It's like any other social or medical issue. It's the combination of many contributing factors that ultimately line-up as a cause. The lack of experience and mental control of youth and powerful machines, regardless of weight or handling prowess contribute the majority of causal factors. The factors of outcomes may change with age and environmental factors, but the physics of speed will always be the major factor there as well.
 

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i still don't know why the us doesnt have the license system like europe, you would think politicians would favor it, but i guess they don't really give 2 shits bout bikers.

it's true there are an extreme small percentage who can hop on a liter bike and be a decent rider (max biaggi) but for the other 99 percent a 250 is way different than a 1000

it's not like anyone except those in the riding community know the difference between a ninja 250 and a r1 anyways except one looks cooler
 

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TemtnF8 said:
not to mention europe uses the progressive lisencing system, which means that for someone to have a 1000cc bike they have to have several years of experience.
That's interesting, I didn't know that.
 

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Interesting, yes. Relevant- not really. Statistics can be manipulated in so many ways to support the view of the author it is not even worth describing.
 
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