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Already Sick of Winter
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how'm i doin on reading for content?

sexyicecold said:
What is your point?
His point was to discredit him by calling him a liberal and turn the "discussion" we were having into another personal assault on someone with opposing views. its one of the reasons this part of the forum got tossed in the trash to begin with.
 

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malik ross said:
His point was to discredit him by calling him a liberal and turn the "discussion" we were having into another personal assault on someone with opposing views. its one of the reasons this part of the forum got tossed in the trash to begin with.
Which is why I asked what his point was to begin with. Attempting to discredit someone by trash talking does not make a point. It makes one look like a trash-talking asshole.

I guess that's why Jim said, "I don't see anything resembling a counter argument here." I didn't see one either. So, I pressed the issue. Do you have a point? Or just a smear?
 

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sexyicecold said:
Do you have a point? Or just a smear?
Point is as clear as a bell. I can't help if it's beyond your ability to grasp.

Smear? Stating that there's a lot of inconsistency in a particular political ideology? Yeah, that was pretty rough! How are we all going to sleep tonight after that one??? :rolleyes

Speaking of seeing no counter argument, I saw none in Jim's reply whatsoever. He made a statement that he had no substantiation for. I asked for it. I also made a clear point that those of your political party don't trust who is in charge in the slightest, and yet you want to give them power over your lives more and more. I'm not arguing whether you are right or wrong about that (the distrust), just pointing out that it makes no sense to give those people that you distrust so much more control over you. Something to which neither of you could come up with a valid or intelligent response to. So, (here's your smear that you are looking for, since you want one so bad) in typical liberal fashion, you just resort to name calling instead. Happy? Now you've got your smear.
 

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crx81 said:
I also made a clear point that those of your political party...

...in typical liberal fashion, you just resort to name calling instead. Happy? Now you've got your smear.
I am not registered to any party and am not a member or affiliated with any political party.
 

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sexyicecold said:
I am not registered to any party and am not a member or affiliated with any political party.

So what? You hold to the same ideologies. You are what you are, not what you register.
 

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jim schmidt said:
I don't see anything resembling a counter argument here.


But you haven't answered my question...Show me ANY government program that is on or under budget and can account for the monies expended...If you can, you are single handedly smarter than all the CPA's working at the GSA...because they can't.

Why would you let these people run the medical system??
 

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So everyone can have health coverage. Obviously, if you think "all government is bad" your judgement will reflect that belief. I dont' happen to think so and I think that, for example, the "socialist medicine" provided to active duty soldiers represents a potential model.

We currently have a program that serves about two-thirds of us. This is the problem to be solved. Every other first world country has done it. Every one. Cuba has done it. Are you saying they're all smarter than us?
 

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bumblebee said:
Name me 1 government program that is run efficiently and not bloated with bureaucracy and graft and that doesn't keep increasing taxes yearly. I'll accept any government program that is on/under budget and can account for the monies expended.....
That's a problem with lack of democracy and representation of the public, not necessarily one of government. If you want these problems fixed, you have to get involved, and that takes work, and it takes throwing people out of office when they dont perform or lie to people. Believe it or not, you can have good, corruption-free government that manages things well. But you are going to get only what you ask for. If you ask for shit, then they will give you shit, or screw you big next time you get sick. Even rich people in this country can lose everything they have if they get sick in this country.
 

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I guess I am too dense here...I have looked repeatedly through-out the Constitution and I can't find Healthcare anywhere...It is not a right...it is a luxury...show me where one of these 1st rate socialized medicine countries has "solved it" without horrendous damage to their economy...Even Sweden, with it's "cradle to grave" healthcare is finding out what a drain of resources it has become and is rethinking their decisions...and they have less than 10 % of the population we have. If Healthcare in Cuba is so great, why do all people needing major procedures come here?? When you take a profit incentive out of the system, the R & D goes into the toilet...

If healthcare were to become socialized...soon, the providers would be exiting the profession in droves, just like in education, because the salaries would be cut by up to 50 % in many fields.

The Insurance companies have created the current fiasco we are in over the last 25 years...There was no Crisis in the 70's and many more people could afford and participated in the system. Doctors weren't closing practices and rural communities had hospitals and practioners...By turning the system over to the government will only make things worse...

For those of you who are such big fans of socialized medicine, maybe you should move to one of these "first rate" countries...I'm sure the 50 to 70 % tax rates won't bother you either

And Jim...you still haven't answered my original question...
 

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bumblebee said:
The Insurance companies have created the current fiasco we are in over the last 25 years...There was no Crisis in the 70's and many more people could afford and participated in the system. Doctors weren't closing practices and rural communities had hospitals and practioners...By turning the system over to the government will only make things worse...
In the 70's most hospitals were community and public hospitals which were not privatized as they are today, they were socialized. And you are correct, there was no crisis at that time.
 

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bumblebee said:
If Healthcare in Cuba is so great, why do all people needing major procedures come here?? When you take a profit incentive out of the system, the R & D goes into the toilet...

If healthcare were to become socialized...soon, the providers would be exiting the profession in droves, just like in education, because the salaries would be cut by up to 50 % in many fields.
What examples do you have of Cubans coming to the United States to get medical procedures?

I've seen the exact opposite - Cuban MDs have gone to other countries, such as Venezuela, to provide medical care to the indigent and others that do not have access to health care because of geographic boundaries/transportation limitations.
 

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Can someone please explain why it is that prisoners get great medical and dental care yet the average citizen can be bankrupted by something needed?
 

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The only thing that scares me is that crazy amounts of horror stories about VA hospitals.

I do know that many a retard gets tossed in jail on purpose to take advantage of the dental and medical system
 

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After I got out of the service I had the option of still receive "tricare" (military medicine) at quite a cheap price. NO, HELL NO. I don't like the fact that most military doctors are there for "training" purposes and have no real clue what they are talking about or dealing with. I have too many stories to tell.
 

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Rascus said:
After I got out of the service I had the option of still receive "tricare" (military medicine) at quite a cheap price. NO, HELL NO. I don't like the fact that most military doctors are there for "training" purposes and have no real clue what they are talking about or dealing with. I have too many stories to tell.
I take it you've never been to a university hospital. :cheers
 

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jim schmidt said:
I take it you've never been to a university hospital. :cheers

I've never been admitted to a hospital nor been to an ER. I've taken my kids and wife but that was when I was in .

All I know is the level of care and personalization I receive from the private sector versus the military is like day and night. I don't mind paying it.
 

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Just put down the donuts and work out every day. Then you won't need healthcare! :eek:nfloor
 

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ty454 said:
Just put down the donuts and work out every day. Then you won't need healthcare! :eek:nfloor

dammit, it's my right to eat that said donut, then sue that said donut maker for not warning me of the risks associated from eating a dozen donuts a day :)
 

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jim schmidt said:
While we're at it. Can someone please explain to me how socialized medicine is good for soldiers but not good for everyone?
Health care for soldiers is not socialized medicine...it is simply an employer providing benefits to it's 1.5 million employees and their dependants

Besides, even with the military, you are talking less than 10 million people...I don't think you realize what premiums would be for 275 million people...If you think there is a social security crisis looming...wait until socialized medicine hits your paycheck...
 
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