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Mediocre Strafer
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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I'm looking for a new bike. Just put the S1000RR on consignment and shipped the Buell 1125CR off to a friend.

Here's the deal - I liked the BMW a lot, but it suffers from the usual supersport issue; the gearing is so tall and narrowly spaced, and the engine powerband so narrow, that there isn't really that much oomph available under normal street riding conditions. It's great on the the track, or any time you're spinning 10K and up, but otherwise underwhelming. (Yes, I have my flame suit on, go right ahead.)

My criteria:

- Smooth engine performance and accurate throttle response
- Traction control and ABS
- Sport bike riding position - anything even "standard" is usually too upright for comfort for me. Somewhere around a Speed Triple is about the limit.
- More available thrust than an S1000RR below 7K
- I don't care for a twin's pulsed power delivery much. I like nice quiet smooth whooshy motors. Triples are ok - I've had two Triumph 955s and only minded the truck-like idle.
- Good suspension, or at least suspension I can adjust or replace
- I'm not particularly sensitive to heavy bikes

What I've looked at:

- K1300S. I thought this was what I was going to get without question. I like the Telelever front end and electronic suspension. Questions arose when I started digging into the forums and found lots of reports of serious vibration and an overall feeling that the model was about to be killed off.

- ZX-14R. I kind of wrote the ZX-14 off last year when they updated it to the R and made it heavier, longer, and more cartoonish in styling. But apparently it's still the smoothest engine around, with ridiculous power and better suspension. And now they have ABS available along with traction control. Biggest concern here is the non-BMW suspension, and that I'd have to deal with another Big Four dealer and sales staff. (Believe me, after working with my BMW dealer, just having to approach a teenage "customer agent" with a hand-written business card is painful.)

- Honda VFR1200S. See above re the sales experience. Also, I wasn't whelmed by the VFR when I rode one at a press intro a couple years ago. The position is a little upright for me, and the suspension is primitive in design. But there are leftover 2010's around for good discounts.

- Hayabusa. No electronics and, while I'm not super-sensitive to appearance , my lord that thing is ugly. Can't imagine why I'd want one instead of a ZX-14R.

What else should I be looking at?

KeS
 

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pick your poison
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No love for the Z1000 or Ninja 1000? Ergos to upright?

'13 Busa will be offered with ABS
 

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Mediocre Strafer
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9,137 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I don't object to naked bikes in general - I kind of like a clean wind stream instead of buffeting, and I don't do enough long distance (more than 300 miles in a day is my current definition of "long distance") to need a fairing. It's a) the riding position and b) the electronics. My Buell 1125CR riding position was more aggressive than many faired sportbikes and I was fine with it.

I tried on a Tuono RSV4 Friday, and a Speed Triple 1050 (the refreshed design) today. Both were at least borderline too upright for me, and neither has ABS available. :(

KeS
 

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Deutsche Rüstungsteilung
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I didn't notice much of an issue with the K1300S. I love that bike.
 

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I think you should give the Z1000 a second look. I took me a few years of searching but I think this is my last bike....


... for a few years anyway :D

I don't ride far (like you) but a ride quite often. The only kink I have with the bike is the miles per tank. It's not a big hassle for me though, I live in a well populated area with lots gas stations.

Also insurance is really cheap for a literbike.
 

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Mediocre Strafer
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
I think you should give the Z1000 a second look. I took me a few years of searching but I think this is my last bike....


... for a few years anyway :D

I don't ride far (like you) but a ride quite often. The only kink I have with the bike is the miles per tank. It's not a big hassle for me though, I live in a well populated area with lots gas stations.

Also insurance is really cheap for a literbike.
Fun bike, but no electronics, don't like the 2013 colors (did they have the orange/white in 2012 - I liked that!) and a buzzy engine from what I remember. I liked the dash and the overall attitude of the bike. Would probably be more likely to end up with a CB1000R if I went that way, I think.

KeS
 

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The cake is a lie
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I tried on a Tuono RSV4 Friday, and a Speed Triple 1050 (the refreshed design) today. Both were at least borderline too upright for me, and neither has ABS available. :(

KeS
You can get the Speed Triple with ABS.

As for other ideas, I can't think of many others right now. I guess you could look at a Ducati SF, a Monster like the S4R, or (if it's available in the US even) the Honda CB1000RA (has ABS)

 

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Mediocre Strafer
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9,137 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 · (Edited)
You can get the Speed Triple with ABS.
Ah, thanks - I was looking on their site with a tablet, and missed that. May be back in play, I like the triple.

I don't see a reference to the CB1000RA on the US site.

KeS

Cool, here's what my custom configured Triple looks like. Of course it's also nearly $17k...
 

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I have a friend who got the New VFR and he had to put in some serious work(PC and custom mapping, dynos, and some other things I can't remember) to awaken that bike! But He's been happy on it so far,,,but He's not enthralled with it either and is already talking about new bikes.

I haven't ridden the z1000, but I have the ninja 1k and it was a really fun bike. Great bottom end and it was really easy to ride. Really disliked the wind either hitting me right in the upper chest/neck or right in the visor regardless of where I put the windscreen and the handle bars were alittle to buzzy for me. The zx14 I rode afterward was just amazing! It felt the Ninja1k started harder from a rolling stop and the guy I was chasing had no problem pulling away from the start(could have been user error on my parta0 but I always caught him once I got spooled up.
 

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honestly, ride a 250 for a while. All this talk about "no lower end" on SS liter bikes is a very distorted perspective. It's all subjective tho i guess. What feels like TONS of pull to some must not feel like much to others when they have been used to a liter bike.
 

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Mediocre Strafer
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
honestly, ride a 250 for a while. All this talk about "no lower end" on SS liter bikes is a very distorted perspective. It's all subjective tho i guess. What feels like TONS of pull to some must not feel like much to others when they have been used to a liter bike.
I rode a Nighthawk 250 for thirty miles this weekend. I'll be riding an SV-650 again down in Baja. I rode a Yamaha dual-sport WR-250(?) last month. I own a 1987 K100RS (which ain't all that power-wise) almost every day.

I ride a *LOT* of bikes, and I know what I like and what I don't. I appreciate your perspective, and agree to some extent about the subjectivity, but this is a thread about what *I* want in a new bike, and I hope it doesn't turn into yet another "it's more fun to ride a small bike fast" thread. I happen to think it's more fun to ride a big bike fast. :)

KeS
 

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Turbo nerd.
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I tried on a Tuono RSV4 Friday, and a Speed Triple 1050 (the refreshed design) today. Both were at least borderline too upright for me, and neither has ABS available. :(

KeS
What year was the Speedy? Pretty sure the 2012s have ABS standard, and the R certainly does.

...and a trip to the local bike store fixes the handle bars for like $60 or check out the apex adjustable clip ons. I fiend of mine had them on his Street Triple and they were about frigging perfect.

I'm still waiting for Triumph to come up with a big triple that is better than the 955i otherwise I'm going to grab an older Daytona somewhere and violate it. I'm just not really into the 1050.
 

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Mediocre Strafer
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
What year was the Speedy? Pretty sure the 2012s have ABS standard, and the R certainly does.

...and a trip to the local bike store fixes the handle bars for like $60 or check out the apex adjustable clip ons. I fiend of mine had them on his Street Triple and they were about frigging perfect.

I'm still waiting for Triumph to come up with a big triple that is better than the 955i otherwise I'm going to grab an older Daytona somewhere and violate it. I'm just not really into the 1050.
Got the ABS correction already, thanks. I'm still a little fuzzy, as some reviews say it is an option on the R, and the configurator on the website says it's an option, but either way it's available.

I had two 955s, a Sprint and a Speed Triple. The ST was *really* too upright for me, but the real problem was the rear suspension, which I just couldn't get to not be harsh (two RaceTech revalve-and-spring iterations). I think it just didn't have enough travel to work with.

I have yet to ride a 1050, but was assuming that the several reworks, including the longer swingarm, would improve this aspect. Why do you say you aren't into the 1050 - is it remarkably different than the 955 motor?

KeS
 

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KeS, I remember back when I asked what was your favorite bike and you said it was the ZX14. Judging by what you said about the S1000R, i think part of you was looking for things from the zx14 that just wasn't being given by the BMW. Not to take away from the BMW but you, like any other rider, have the things you look for in a bike and i really think you want another ZX14(R).

You probably will not be tracking this bike (who knows, you are KeS after all and would track a golf cart just for the sake of it), but as you also stated that you ride lots of bikes so finding another track bike doesn't seem like a huge concern with this bike.
 

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Turbo nerd.
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I have yet to ride a 1050, but was assuming that the several reworks, including the longer swingarm, would improve this aspect. Why do you say you aren't into the 1050 - is it remarkably different than the 955 motor?

KeS
The 1050 is more V-twin then the 955i it pulls like a truck and all, but that is also my issue with it it pulls like a truck. Once you get to 4500rpm it doesn't really feel like it going any faster till hit the limiter...and that limiter is pretty low.

I REALLY REALLY liked the 2nd gen Daytona 955i it feels a bit more I-4ish in that there IS a torque curve not to mention another 25hp or so at the wheel.

So far as the rear suspension, they were trial and erroring on THAT fucking thing forever. If you look at PNs there is either a new dogbone or linkage like every two years going back to my 2000.

The 2011 was a redesign, I can't tell if its any better I haven't done anymore with that bike than sit on it at the local dealer. The reviews all said that they got the handling more toward the Street Triple than the older speedy, but I haven't taken one out.
 

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Mediocre Strafer
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Discussion Starter · #18 · (Edited)
KeS, I remember back when I asked what was your favorite bike and you said it was the ZX14. Judging by what you said about the S1000R, i think part of you was looking for things from the zx14 that just wasn't being given by the BMW. Not to take away from the BMW but you, like any other rider, have the things you look for in a bike and i really think you want another ZX14(R).

You probably will not be tracking this bike (who knows, you are KeS after all and would track a golf cart just for the sake of it), but as you also stated that you ride lots of bikes so finding another track bike doesn't seem like a huge concern with this bike.
Oh, sure I'd be tracking whatever I get - I *like* riding my street bikes at the track. I learn a lot. Hell, I almost took the 1987 K100 to a Lee Parks track school earlier this year, just because the S1000RR was silly overkill for where we were (Horsethief Mile at Willow Springs), and I knew Lee would get a kick out of it. I took the S1000RR instead, and sure enough he ragged me about it. :)

The only reason I sold the 2006 ZX-14 in the first place was to get the electronics, so yes, the 14R is appealing. It's just so much heavier than it was - the 14 put on a lot of weight in 2008, and again with the rework in 2012. But what it may come down to is while I like the BMW Telelever, I really HATE a buzzy bike. I'll give them ten days to sort the K1300S, if they can't, then I'll start waiting on a 2013 ZX-14R. And in the meantime I'll try to score a ride on a S3R. ;)

KeS

BTW - my S1000RR is on consignment at SDBMW if you know anyone who wants one. It has the special Lee's Cycle dogbone that improves the rear suspension rate (like BMW put into the 2012s).
 

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Mediocre Strafer
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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
The 1050 is more V-twin then the 955i it pulls like a truck and all, but that is also my issue with it it pulls like a truck. Once you get to 4500rpm it doesn't really feel like it going any faster till hit the limiter...and that limiter is pretty low.

I REALLY REALLY liked the 2nd gen Daytona 955i it feels a bit more I-4ish in that there IS a torque curve not to mention another 25hp or so at the wheel.

So far as the rear suspension, they were trial and erroring on THAT fucking thing forever. If you look at PNs there is either a new dogbone or linkage like every two years going back to my 2000.

The 2011 was a redesign, I can't tell if its any better I haven't done anymore with that bike than sit on it at the local dealer. The reviews all said that they got the handling more toward the Street Triple than the older speedy, but I haven't taken one out.
I don't want a torque curve. I want a torque line. :) That's what was so awesome about the 2006 ZX-14 (with the secondary butterflies removed and a PC3 installed). Any engine speed, any gear, any throttle position - no matter what you asked for you got it - exactly and instantly. Just be careful what you ask for!

Best praise I can give is taking that bike to Laguna Seca - in the rain - and having complete confidence and comfort riding the track. The Triple motor always struck me the same way, and it has that wonderful whine to it as well. We'll see.

KeS
 

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Turbo nerd.
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I don't want a torque curve. I want a torque line. :) That's what was so awesome about the 2006 ZX-14 (with the secondary butterflies removed and a PC3 installed). Any engine speed, any gear, any throttle position - no matter what you asked for you got it - exactly and instantly. Just be careful what you ask for!

Best praise I can give is taking that bike to Laguna Seca - in the rain - and having complete confidence and comfort riding the track. The Triple motor always struck me the same way, and it has that wonderful whine to it as well. We'll see.

KeS
Yeah, you'd love the 1050 its actually a torque plateau that doesn't really move much after 4000rpm or so. Its linear like that.
 

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