Obama And Taxes

[SXSMITH]

Not only No. But FUCK NO! This seals the deal for me. Vote McCain!

What Obama means by tax the wealthy - Jun. 27, 2008

Income taxes
Obama would restore the top two income tax rates to their pre-2001 levels of 36% and 39.6%. Currently they're 33% and 35%.

Payroll taxes
In addition to wages up to $102,000 - the current cap on salary subject to the payroll tax, which funds Social Security - Obama would also tax amounts over $250,000.

[mr. coffee]

Gee higher taxes for those making $250K or more, or another 10 years in Iraq*. Hmmm...




*I'm sorry I meant a 100.

[flylooper]

Originally Posted by SXSMITH

Not only No. But FUCK NO! This seals the deal for me. Vote McCain!

What Obama means by tax the wealthy - Jun. 27, 2008

Income taxes
Obama would restore the top two income tax rates to their pre-2001 levels of 36% and 39.6%. Currently they're 33% and 35%.

Payroll taxes
In addition to wages up to $102,000 - the current cap on salary subject to the payroll tax, which funds Social Security - Obama would also tax amounts over $250,000.

LOL. C'mon, Smith. Was there ever a doubt? You'd vote McCain if you were on welfare. (Are you on welfare?)

I paid >$17,000 in fed and state income taxes last year. And I'm STILL voting for Obama. The people who can afford to pay a relative tax burden, should pay it.

It's what your distant uncle Adam Smith himself recommends.

[SXSMITH]

Originally Posted by flylooper

LOL. C'mon, Smith. Was there ever a doubt? You'd vote McCain if you were on welfare. (Are you on welfare?)

Not yet. Obama hasn't taken office.

Why on earth would you go out and make extra money doing something important if governments would take more than half?

40% federal, ~8% payroll, & ~5% state.

[flylooper]

God! What a miserable way to live a life. Your employer (Comcast, is it?) pays the payroll tax. If they thing you're worth it, they'll pay it. If not...well....!!!

And.....just look what you get for your 39%! A nice war; endless 1 hour crap on all those great weapons on The Military Channel; stuff you love.

Let me add that Obama wants to RESTORE the previous levels. Not RAISE them. And it's only for really wealthy people - like you - who have contributed nothing to the war effort.

[Mr. Whippy]

Originally Posted by flylooper

LOL. C'mon, Smith. Was there ever a doubt? You'd vote McCain if you were on welfare. (Are you on welfare?)

I paid >$17,000 in fed and state income taxes last year. And I'm STILL voting for Obama. The people who can afford to pay a relative tax burden, should pay it.

It's what your distant uncle Adam Smith himself recommends.

Is that a lot of tax to pay?

Look, the debt has to be paid. It's gonna be painful. It's gonna be spread to everyone either on the front end (paying more) or the backend (less services). No way around it. Thank the SF sewerage plant and his congressional colleagues.

SMITH, you're gonna pay for the dumbass, just like I am. Obama is simply more honest about it than McCain.

[flylooper]

Originally Posted by Mr. Whippy

Is that a lot of tax to pay?

Look, the debt has to be paid. It's gonna be painful. It's gonna be spread to everyone either on the front end (paying more) or the backend (less services). No way around it. Thank the SF sewerage plant and his congressional colleagues.

SMITH, you're gonna pay for the dumbass, just like I am. Obama is simply more honest about it than McCain.

BINGO. Bulls eye. Right on.

We all help each other. One man's sewage treatment plant is another man's waste of money. I can tell you firsthand, though, that the city was in dire need of that plant. (I think local bonds paid for it - or at least most of it - though, but don't quote me.)

[SXSMITH]

Originally Posted by flylooper

God! What a miserable way to live a life. Your employer (Comcast, is it?) pays the payroll tax.

Well, there goes all your credibility.

The work you do pays the tax. Companies don't borrow money to pay it for you. So in reality you're paying the 15%+ payroll tax from your labor.

If you think otherwise, you're a complete fool.

And the work I was referring to in the previous post was self-employment. Few places are going to pay you $250k+ to be their slave.

What incentive do people have to start a side business if taxes are going to be more than half of their income?

This mindset (yours and Obama's) in the pursuit of income redistribution really keeps individuals from achieving more.

And if you succeed in crushing the people who exceed the norm and this nation becomes more like Russia or Mexico, you'll just call it "bad luck".

When I sold my business and taxes were that high, guess who got fucked more than I did. You and your government.

[SXSMITH]

Originally Posted by Mr. Whippy

SMITH, you're gonna pay for the dumbass, just like I am. Obama is simply more honest about it than McCain.

How about cutting the budget a trillion or so. That will help.

[Mr. Whippy]

Originally Posted by SXSMITH

How about cutting the budget a trillion or so. That will help.

Well, let's see, they can make the small non-commercial pilots pay a lot more user fees so all of us non-pilots don't have to subsidize air traffic controllers, and the various support services for what is really just an expensive hobby.

Next, they can make states pay for freeway upkeep--including bridges and whatnot. Again, a user fee setup comes to mind. They could lop off the Air Force completely and save a ton of money. Really not needed. You could have most air related missions run from Naval positions and have the Army run the land based ops. That's where it started anyway. Close that eff'n problematic Air Force Academy with its rapist/student program. That could save a big chunk of money.

Guess it comes down to who's ox is getting gored.

Like I said. Pay more or get less It's still gotta be paid.

[Gaolee]

Originally Posted by SXSMITH

How about cutting the budget a trillion or so. That will help.

Well, considering the way we are pouring money into the sandbox, it will be kinda tough. Likewise, there's a bit of debt service to pay. We can't very well cut that out. It is called a default, but you are probably not familiar with the term.

So, somehow, some way, we have to pay back the debt. Here's where the money goes. Where do we cut to get a trillion or so? (Yeah, it is a couple years out of date, so sue me. It has just got worse, if anything, and interest on the national debt will go up with interest rates, not down when we have the coming stagflation I have been harping on for a few years now.)



Here is another look at it. We only have a trillion we can cut without defaulting on something.



As long as we are at it, here is where the money comes from. Cut taxes one place, you have to either pay interest on the resulting debt or raise taxes and revenues somewhere else.



Turning the Queen Mary is going to take a while and it is going to hurt. dumb'ya steered the Queen Mary onto economic rocks, and the next president, either McCain or Obama is going to have to deal with it. McCain will be less likely to for ideological and political reasons. Obama has his baggage, but I hope (the pesky word) he will take it on in a way similar to what Clinton did. He will have a very hard time doing it, since he is inheriting an economy in the same shape as it was under Ford and Carter. It is going to be an ugly few years before this gets righted, and I am going to vote for Obama in the full knowledge he may be a one term president due to the mess he has to clean up.

[flylooper]

Originally Posted by SXSMITH

Well, there goes all your credibility.

The work you do pays the tax. Companies don't borrow money to pay it for you. So in reality you're paying the 15%+ payroll tax from your labor.

If you think otherwise, you're a complete fool.

And the work I was referring to in the previous post was self-employment. Few places are going to pay you $250k+ to be their slave.

What incentive do people have to start a side business if taxes are going to be more than half of their income?

This mindset (yours and Obama's) in the pursuit of income redistribution really keeps individuals from achieving more.

And if you succeed in crushing the people who exceed the norm and this nation becomes more like Russia or Mexico, you'll just call it "bad luck".

When I sold my business and taxes were that high, guess who got fucked more than I did. You and your government.

What you dont understand, and people like you never have understood, is that there is no relationship between taxation and income / quality of life. You constantly harangue us with your shit about the economy is going to tank with high taxes. People will no longer work if taxes are too high. The world will come to a fucking end.

Companies pay people what the market says they're worth. If you paid ZERO taxes, I can assure you that you'd be making far less than you do. If you paid 70% of your income in taxes, companies will pay you what you're worth in comparison with other people offering the same labor. There is not fucking correlation.

If you care to check, some of the best economic times this country enjoyed was when the marginal income tax rate was something like 80% (the 50s and 60's enjoyed great growth, generally, with the usual business cycle slow-downs. Unions were strong. People were making a good wage, white collar workers were doing well. And income taxes were high.

I take you and all your little libertarian nutters as just another iteration of the I-got-mine-so-fuck-you crowd. You don't like government. You don't like taxes, you think the world runs on auto-pilot. You don't even like the idea of modern government.

Here we are, 300 million people, a 13 trillion dollar economy, the entire country - and the globe - interlinked in every conceivable way and you and your nut case friends want to return to some kind of New England town hall form of government.

Let me tell you something. It isn't going to happen, dude. It ISN'T going to happen. So either learn to love it, or move to, say, Congo, where it's every man for himself.

The world is way too complex for you guys. You don't get it. You don't get that a coal train delivering 100 carloads of coal to a Denver Power station affects me in Oregon. Or that deforestation in the Northwest affects the people in Dallas. We're all in this together, Mofo. Or that Enron's chicanery in Houston screwed me out of several hundred dollars in additional gas and electric costs in California. All due to that fact that no one was watching the store in DC. You don't even get that you're paying ENORMOUS taxes in the form of gasoline costs due entirely to our adventure in the ME and our refusal to invest in alternatives beginning 30 years ago. And the worst tax of all in the decreased buying power of the dollar, I don't hear a peep out of you goofs.

I don't hear - or read about - ANYONE in western Europe bitching about their tax rates. I don't see Canadians rushing to the US to escape their VAT. I don't even know of any Canadians bitching about their medical care, for that matter, to the extent that they come here for care, like all the bullshit stories people like to post. (Lots of shit floating around on that one!)

So....fuck off, dude. You and your type just bore the living shit out of me. (At least this morning, for sure.)

PS: If you'd like more, just let me know.

[baldheadeddork]

Dear Smith-

Fuck you.


Sincerely,

The children and unborn who are going to have to pay the bills you ran up because you thought millionaires wouldn't get out of bed if they had to pay a little more in taxes.

[BusaDave]

Originally Posted by SXSMITH

Why on earth would you go out and make extra money doing something important if governments would take more than half?

You should probably be asking that question to the significant portion of the population who do just that every day. In my case, half of more is still more, and my disposable income still increases.

I have yet to stop working because of taxes. Can't say I know anyone who has.