If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above.
You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed.
To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.
Politics & ReligionWell Since every damn forum has one. Might as well leave it out there. This place is loosely moderated and should not be entered if you're weak of heart.
I'm inclined to think he'll do his best to do what he says on this one. A (thin) majority of Americans want it, but a great majority of Americans who might vote for him (or do so again) want it. If he does backtrack, it certainly won't be until after the election (assuming he wins this time), since this is the biggest issue to whack McCain with and bring out his supporters in force. But if he then wants to get re-elected (again, assuming he wins this time), he better follow through on it.
PhilB
__________________
'93 Ducati Monster 900
158,000 miles (so far)
I'm inclined to think he'll do his best to do what he says on this one. A (thin) majority of Americans want it, but a great majority of Americans who might vote for him (or do so again) want it. If he does backtrack, it certainly won't be until after the election (assuming he wins this time), since this is the biggest issue to whack McCain with and bring out his supporters in force. But if he then wants to get re-elected (again, assuming he wins this time), he better follow through on it.
PhilB
if he gets Webb as his VP he can blaim it on him
__________________
In life, you only need two tools - WD-40 and Duct tape.
If it doesn't move but should, use the WD-40.
If it shouldn't move and does, use the duct tape.
Quote:
Originally Posted by doggy69
Why is it that people jump on people assuming its their first bike...because they just joined the forum....maybe they just want to converse and ask questions...people can ride for eternity without coming here for our infinite wisdom
Quote:
Originally Posted by R.Brosnan
It's better to learn on a 250 for all the same reasons that experts can make a 600 do so much more. The design compromises that make a sportbike so responsive in the hands of an expert also make it amplify the mistakes of a beginner.
Posts: 3,954
Casino Cash: $24886
Sportbike: Too many but never enough
Quote:
Originally Posted by Choco
depends how many votes barr could pull. he may need to pander to the neocons for a few votes.
Obama, pander to the neocons? That's the one constituency I would be very surprised to see Obama pander to. Anybody else, sure, but not them. McCain, on the other hand, has to make sure he gets them, because they are going to be his source of cash and the source of cash for 527s supporting him.
__________________
Go soothingly on the grease mud, as there lurks the skid demon.
2006 Daytona 675 street squid bike
1999 SV650 track tool and face plant master
1991 Husky 610 bitsa, tard, dirt weapon, and oil puddle creator
1971 Norton Commando garage ornament
1973 Chevy blingin' hooptie van bike hauler
I'm inclined to think he'll do his best to do what he says on this one. A (thin) majority of Americans want it...
It's not a thin majority. If you ask the question how long should we stay in Iraq and offer different periods of time to withdraw, 70% want our troops out within five years. That's the same percentage that wants either an immediate withdrawal or a timetable to get the job done.
The only poll that got close to what you're saying is a recent WSJ/NBC poll that only gave two options: Withdraw most troops by the beginning of 2009 (seven months from now) or stay until the country is stable. Even then, an immediate withdrawal won 49-45.
To the question in the original post - he won't back off because he can't. This isn't politics, the deployment schedule in Iraq has broken the National Guard and Reserves as a capable force and it is breaking the Army. The next president, whoever it is, will have to quickly get us down to under 20,000 support staff and advisers in Iraq or we will destroy our country's ground forces. We never had the manpower to maintain a 130,000+ deployment in Iraq for five years, the damage Bush has done by pretending we did will take a decade to repair.
I think he will say whatever his handlers think will get him the most votes, and he will worry about the reality of the situation later
That about sums up every political race there is. And there's still people that think these candidates are heroes that will go in and fix everything.
I saw a headline in The Onion earlier in the primaries when John Edwards was around, and it was something like "John Edwards Vows to End All Bad Things by 2011" funny as hell, but that's what they're promising.
__________________ No better way to show your affection than a quick...wiener cup.
He is still a politician, I suspect that particular campaign promise will evaporate within a month of the inauguration. My money says we have more troops in Iraq at the end of Obama's term than at the start.
There is a REASON that there is a 5 year time-table. That way he doesn't have to show any results at all until his second term, so he can't get nailed on the re-election. Meaning that he really doesn't have to pull anyone out to see two terms. This is NOT a coincidence.
It's not a thin majority. If you ask the question how long should we stay in Iraq and offer different periods of time to withdraw, 70% want our troops out within five years. That's the same percentage that wants either an immediate withdrawal or a timetable to get the job done.
The only poll that got close to what you're saying is a recent WSJ/NBC poll that only gave two options: Withdraw most troops by the beginning of 2009 (seven months from now) or stay until the country is stable. Even then, an immediate withdrawal won 49-45.
To the question in the original post - he won't back off because he can't. This isn't politics, the deployment schedule in Iraq has broken the National Guard and Reserves as a capable force and it is breaking the Army. The next president, whoever it is, will have to quickly get us down to under 20,000 support staff and advisers in Iraq or we will destroy our country's ground forces. We never had the manpower to maintain a 130,000+ deployment in Iraq for five years, the damage Bush has done by pretending we did will take a decade to repair.
I'm sure it depends on who you ask and how. One indication for me, though, is that if there is something that the big political parties are good at, it's seizing on issues that they think will draw out voters. McCain has been strongly promoting his support for the war, while Obama has been more subdued on the subject (and Clinton waffled about). That indicates to me that none of them think that opposing the war is a clearly winning issue, which would make me think that the country may be more evenly divided than you think. Even here in definitely-left-leaning-CA, I still see a fair bit of support for the war; I bet there are a lot of states where opposition is a minority.
If you (and that poll) are right, though, (a) that's good news, and (b) it only strengthens my position in this thread that Obama will try to keep his word on this because failing to do so will cost him future votes.
PhilB
__________________
'93 Ducati Monster 900
158,000 miles (so far)
I'm sure it depends on who you ask and how. One indication for me, though, is that if there is something that the big political parties are good at, it's seizing on issues that they think will draw out voters. McCain has been strongly promoting his support for the war, while Obama has been more subdued on the subject (and Clinton waffled about). That indicates to me that none of them think that opposing the war is a clearly winning issue, which would make me think that the country may be more evenly divided than you think. Even here in definitely-left-leaning
When will Obama back off on troop withdrawal promise?
