Wiretapping Nixed?

Choco · 08-17-2006, 05:16 PM

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14393611/

Wonder how long the appeal will take?

bush · 08-17-2006, 05:27 PM

I don't think it will make much of a difference in the long run, unfortunately. The only hope we have is for the debate to rage long enough for Bush to leave office, and hopefully somebody less invasive will take office.

Punkwood2k · 08-17-2006, 06:05 PM

It doesnt matter. The government has been doing it for decades, either lawfully or unlawfully. the only issue here is that if it remains legal, they can admit the evidence in court. When done unlawfully, they use the info the get to center on a specific group. But it has ALWAYS been done, and always continue to be done.
Do some research on the Carnivore project. The government has been scanning all emails, telephone conversations, and any other electronic communications for the past 30+ years. I know it sounds like a conspiracy theory, except that my grandfather was one of the ones that created it, and he is the biggest Anti-government man you will find now.

psudy · 08-18-2006, 10:33 AM

Chalk up another win for the terrorists handed to them by the ACLU.

hanglowejohnson · 08-18-2006, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psudy

Chalk up another win for the terrorists handed to them by the ACLU.

lmao

im glad you take your personal freedoms so lightly.... When exactly do YOU draw the line?

psudy · 08-18-2006, 11:25 AM

The tapping is used to listen to suspected terrorists. So they can stop them before they blow shit up. People that think they are sitting around listening to every conversation are fucking retarded. That would take a call station the size of India. What freedom are they taking away? I don't feel less free. Its a new kind of fight, and we have to use new kinds of measures.

sexyicecold · 08-18-2006, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psudy

Chalk up another win for the terrorists handed to them by the ACLU.

How about "chalk up another win for our freedom, privacy, and civil liberties?"

I was glad to hear this on the news last night. I hope it sticks.

hanglowejohnson · 08-18-2006, 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psudy

The tapping is used to listen to suspected terrorists. So they can stop them before they blow shit up. People that think they are sitting around listening to every conversation are fucking retarded. That would take a call station the size of India. What freedom are they taking away? I don't feel less free. Its a new kind of fight, and we have to use new kinds of measures.

If you seriously think those kinds of wiretaps could never affect you or average citizens like you... then I cant help you.

As soon as you pull your head out of the sand let me know.

L8 Braker · 08-18-2006, 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Punkwood2k

It doesnt matter. The government has been doing it for decades, either lawfully or unlawfully.

And regardless of some new law, they'll continue doing it until the end of time..

psudy · 08-18-2006, 12:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hanglowejohnson

If you seriously think those kinds of wiretaps could never affect you or average citizens like you... then I cant help you.

As soon as you pull your head out of the sand let me know.

How would it affect me? If you are doing illegal shit, then thats the price you pay. If they want to sit around and listen to me have a conversation with my wife, I could care less. The only way it could affect the average Law abiding citizen is if they stop doing it and something else slips through the cracks.

steingar · 08-18-2006, 01:25 PM

Secret wiretaps are a really bad, bad, bad thing. Its how secret police keep tabs on the citizenry in totolitarian states. I have no doubt that the current administration is only using these to combat terrorism, but if allowed to stand the line will be crossed where a future government will use them for political purposes. Most importantly, they are illegal in this country. Yahh, it would be easier for the cops or the FBI or whoever to bust in wherever and whenever they want. However, America would no longer be the land of the free.

psudy · 08-18-2006, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by steingar

Secret wiretaps are a really bad, bad, bad thing. Its how secret police keep tabs on the citizenry in totolitarian states. I have no doubt that the current administration is only using these to combat terrorism, but if allowed to stand the line will be crossed where a future government will use them for political purposes. Most importantly, they are illegal in this country. Yahh, it would be easier for the cops or the FBI or whoever to bust in wherever and whenever they want. However, America would no longer be the land of the free.

If used the way is is suppose to be used, I am all for it, but you are absolutly right. How could we ever monitor it. Maybe the best thing to do is make it illegal and inadmisable, so they have to listen for other things to catch them on.

jk750 · 08-18-2006, 04:28 PM

I find it very interesting that the ACLU had to shop this case around the country just to find a liberal, activist Judge that would find favor in this case.

Where are the Libertarians? Where are the checks and balances?

This isn't the sole purview of conservatives, either. It was FDR and liberal democrats who shipped off whole communities of Japanese-Americans without due process during WWII. It was deemed unconstitutional by lower courts during the war, the ruling was stayed until uppeal, and replealed only after the war.

Sound familiar?

hanglowejohnson · 08-18-2006, 05:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jk750

I find it very interesting that the ACLU had to shop this case around the country just to find a liberal, activist Judge that would find favor in this case.

Where are the Libertarians? Where are the checks and balances?

This isn't the sole purview of conservatives, either. It was FDR and liberal democrats who shipped off whole communities of Japanese-Americans without due process during WWII. It was deemed unconstitutional by lower courts during the war, the ruling was stayed until uppeal, and replealed only after the war.

Sound familiar?

So because that wrong was perpetrated in the past that makes a similar wrong done today ok?

Let's hope that isnt where you were going with that....

As an aside.. is it, or is it not part of the patriot act that there is no minimum to hold someone without being actually under arrest?

We as citizens (you as an LE included) CANNOT for one second allow our liberties to errode... you may be on the outside looking in now, but what happens when YOU are the one losing your freedom because of other people's fear?

Punkwood2k · 08-18-2006, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by psudy

The tapping is used to listen to suspected terrorists. So they can stop them before they blow shit up. People that think they are sitting around listening to every conversation are fucking retarded. That would take a call station the size of India. What freedom are they taking away? I don't feel less free. Its a new kind of fight, and we have to use new kinds of measures.

its easier than you think it is... and they dont use a call station, its simply software meant to recognize certain words or phrases, that throws up a flag to look a little deeper.