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Open ForumsThe Open forum was created for people to discuss anything else Non-Moto related. Just about anything goes! Please remember this is a loosely moderated area. If you do not have thick skin. We suggest you stay out of here.
^^^ as I said many posts ago.... even the smallest amount of expansion may seem insignificant on a large scale it runs into huge amounts....
and for the un believers in "expansion" and liquids, please take a sealed unopened soda can put it on your stove with the burner turned up high and watch the resultant expansion do its biz and be prepared to be covered with scalding soda..... cans of beans in the campfire also work
On second thought don't do that although the beans are a great prank
AMEN, Krazy!!!
The only potential problem I can see with the example you use, is then you have people who start to fixate on the "steam" issue. Then they start arguing about "just when will your fuel boil". Let 'em see a can of soda come outta the freezer lookin' like the Goodyear blimp, and THEN they get the point!
__________________ Able to split an infinitive at the speed of sound!
Well when using the freezer your changing it from a liquid to a solid...your just proving that the solid takes up more space than the liquid...can you prove that the liquid at room temp takes up more room than the liquid in the freezer before the change in state.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robert_s_hunter
AMEN, Krazy!!!
The only potential problem I can see with the example you use, is then you have people who start to fixate on the "steam" issue. Then they start arguing about "just when will your fuel boil". Let 'em see a can of soda come outta the freezer lookin' like the Goodyear blimp, and THEN they get the point!
Well said Rob ..... I just like to see em wearing a bit of the learnins tends to sink in better LMAO
then again steam is a byproduct of heat expansion Funny observation here... you have dual therm expansion effects at work
Well when using the freezer your changing it from a liquid to a solid...your just proving that the solid takes up more space than the liquid...can you prove that the liquid at room temp takes up more room than the liquid in the freezer before the change in state.
Well, as evidence that thermal expansion of fuels is an issue, I'll cite the fact that tankers are equiped with oversized tanks. This is done to provide for what is referred to in the industry as "outage". Fuel tanks on vehicles are also larger in volume than their rated capacity, for the same reason. Next time you are someplace where there are large trucks, go over and look for something that looks like a VIN plate on one of the fuel tanks. It'll actually tell you the true capacity as well as the rated capacity. I think you'll be surprised at the difference!
Empirical evidence of the thermal expansion, is the fact that as the fuel in the tanks of a semi-tractor warms (due to recirculation of fuel through the return-line), you can find that the level in a tank can actually rise! Further, in engineering, the measurement of fuel usage is made by weight and NOT by quantity. If you care to do a little research into SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) testing standards you will find that when performing fuel efficiency research the fuel tanks are actually removed and weighed, both before and after testing, in order to determine the fuel weight as it's volume is an inaccurate form of measurement.
In reality all matter is viscous, it's just a question of it's density. Even so-called "solids" expand and contract, even within relatively small temperature variations. That's why they put expansion joints in damn near every large surface.....
__________________ Able to split an infinitive at the speed of sound!
The amount is so small from my understanding. Not sure what they want the station to do, if the tank is underground there is nothing they can do. If the tank is above ground not much you can do but put in a below ground tank or maybe paint the tanks white or a roof over them.
Canada and many other countries sell gas based on a temperature compensated price. They don't have to regulate the temperature on the tanks, they just have to regulate the price based on the temperature. The price is set based on a fixed temperature, any variation of that temperature can be financially accounted for. This isnt rocket science here.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 750rider
true & very weird!
cool info on the gas biz, thanks.
Thats why some light bulbs change color after a period of time and need replaced even though they still "light up" certain atoms are so small they pass right through quartz glass. Neon mostly. It's used in a mixture to control the color output of a bulb.
I thought liquids cant be compressed, so how would temp effect the volume of gas your receiving.
Dont get me wrong, I get my gas at the coolest part of the day when I can because I have heard this before...but someone brought that up to my attention and I don't have an answer for it.
So if one of you guys could draw it out for me it would be much appreciated.
Actually, liquids can be compressed. But it requires pressures that are extremely high.
although the beans are a great prank 
Dam Munky!
..... I just like to see em wearing a bit of the learnins 
Funny observation here... you have dual therm expansion effects at work 
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