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Open ForumsThe Open forum was created for people to discuss anything else Non-Moto related. Just about anything goes! Please remember this is a loosely moderated area. If you do not have thick skin. We suggest you stay out of here.
Understand that GROUNDSPEED does not matter for an airplane, forward or backward it has no effect on AIRSPEED. AIRSPEED is what you need to make a plane fly...so it will take off!
Here's the opposite of the arugment for you guys...A plane is sitting on the runway and needs to get moving 50kts to take off. The plane is not moving on the ground, but the wind is a constant 60kt headwind...acording to you guys the plane wont take off because it's not moving in relation to the ground.
Understand that GROUNDSPEED does not matter for an airplane, forward or backward it has no effect on AIRSPEED. AIRSPEED is what you need to make a plane fly...so it will take off!
Here's the opposite of the arugment for you guys...A plane is sitting on the runway and needs to get moving 50kts to take off. The plane is not moving on the ground, but the wind is a constant 60kt headwind...acording to you guys the plane wont take off because it's not moving in relation to the ground.
please explain my sea plane on a river deal,if the plane can only match the rivers speed how does it take off?
so if we put a sea plane on a river,the plane can only match the speed of the river it will take off?
i am just stupid i guess i dont see how it can,lol
This is totally different than the original question, because you have the plane's floats matching the speed of the river. The original question does not pose that the plane's wheels match the speed of the conveyor. It has the conveyor matching the speed of the plane.
Even if the conveyor vastly exceeds the speed of the plane, the plane will still move forward and take off normally.
Please, see the links I provided if you don't follow what I'm saying.
please explain my sea plane on a river deal,if the plane can only match the rivers speed how does it take off?
The seaplane is very different because the water will push the plane back and it will cause a very large amount of drag. In theory though, the river could move as fast as it wanted, because the prop of the plane is using the air to pull it. It's not pushing off the water for thrust.
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Originally Posted by cws6fan
Okay, flame away for me bringing this thread back.
I can't stand it anymore.
The plane will not take off. Go back to the example of the skateboard on the tread mill. If you place the skateboard on the treadmill and just start the treadmill, where will the skateboard go? It will ride with the treadmill till it falls off the end, right. If you hold the skateboard with your hand, on the running treadmill, you are giving the skateboard "thrust" to stay in one spot.
If you push the skateboard forward, it will in fact, go forward on the running treadmill, but the treadmill is still running at a constant speed. If the treadmill matched you're movement forward, you would remain stationary on the treadmill.
Same way with the seaplane. The more current against you, the more thrust you need to reach takeoff speed. You keep increasing thrust untill you overcome the resistance. IMO, Gravity is you're biggest resistance.
You are completely wrong. Reread some posts and try again. There is no limit imposed on the length of the treadmill.
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This conveyer has a control system that tracks the plane speed and tunes the speed of the conveyer to be exactly the same (but in opposite direction)."
this is one of the tricky parts of the question i think people are getting confused with.
the plane speed relation to the ground and wheel speed can be completely different. ok- so your saying if the plane speed is 50 knts and you set the conveyor belt to move at 50 knts the plane will not move? why?
the wheels will be spinning at 50 knts to match the conveyor, yes? this is not what we are arguing because we can all agree, right? but the JET ENGINE is pusing the STATIONARY AIR backwards. everything you push on pushes back on you, so the plane will move forward.
if you were standing 100 yards away, the planes wheels will be moving really fast, but it will still be moving forward at the regular rate it would always take off at.
when i mentioned the seaplane i was trying to help people understand a little better through a different example that was somewhat similar, but in the end i think it just confused them.
i was simply pointing out that wheels are not what pushes an airplane forward, as you can see with a seaplane.
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if the tread matches the speed of the plane it only needs to be as long as the plane?
no, this is why people kept sayin the military would have used that a long time ago.
the plane will still need its regular amount of distance to take off. if it needed X amount of feet to take off before, it will still need X amount of feet during this scenario.
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disclaimer: anything i say can be wrong. anything i say in the above post cannot and will not be used against me. all comments void after 24 hours. under some circumstances i may be lying. under other circumstances, comments may be full of shit. use your best judgement. i am not at fault for any harm or death caused to you or your loved ones.
the plane speed relation to the ground and wheel speed can be completely different. ok- so your saying if the plane speed is 50 knts and you set the conveyor belt to move at 50 knts the plane will not move? why?
the wheels will be spinning at 50 knts to match the conveyor, yes? this is not what we are arguing because we can all agree, right? but the JET ENGINE is pusing the STATIONARY AIR backwards. everything you push on pushes back on you, so the plane will move forward.
Correction if plane was moving 50 kts forward, and the conveyor belt was moving 50 the opposite direction, the wheel speed(ground speed) is 100kts even though the airspeed is only 50kts
I understand the argument, and I guess I have to give it to you. If the treadmill matches the groundspeed, the plane will in fact take off.
I guess I am thinking the conveyor can somehow match the thrust from the engines. If the conveyor could somehow match thrust, the plane would set still and not take off.
Like others have said, if the conveyor matches the movement forward, the plane will, in fact, takeoff.
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I understand the argument, and I guess I have to give it to you. If the treadmill matches the groundspeed, the plane will in fact take off.
I guess I am thinking the conveyor can somehow match the thrust from the engines. If the conveyor could somehow match thrust, the plane would set still and not take off.
Like others have said, if the conveyor matches the movement forward, the plane will, in fact, takeoff.
That's the same thing I was stuck on for so long! The treadmill is a non-factor. I kept thinking the plane would have to stay stationary relative to everything around it, even though I knew wheelspeed has nothing to do with airspeed and thrust pushes/pulls the plane through the air. The plane still needs the same amount of room to take off regardless of the surface it's sitting on, aside from the friction issue which has already been discussed.
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I understand the argument, and I guess I have to give it to you. If the treadmill matches the groundspeed, the plane will in fact take off.
I guess I am thinking the conveyor can somehow match the thrust from the engines. If the conveyor could somehow match thrust, the plane would set still and not take off.
Like others have said, if the conveyor matches the movement forward, the plane will, in fact, takeoff.
The conveyor itself couldn't, under any circumstance, match the thrust from the engines. The belt has no means of imparting force to the aircraft, as the wheels are essentially free-rolling. Otherwise, you've basically got it....
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Jamie and Adam take wing to test if a person with no flight training can safely land an airplane and if a plane can take off from a conveyor belt speeding in the opposite direction. Tory, Grant, and Kari jump on some Hollywood-inspired skydiving myths.
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