Handgun advice.

[E-Rawk]

Thanks for all the suggestions guys, I feel much more educated and will be going to the shooting range soon...

[ASCI_Blue]

Big thing that I didn't see too many people mention or anyone mention at all is get something you can stand to hold onto securely. You can't hit shit if you can't get a good grip on your gun. From what some of the old time Glock owners have said the Glock used to feel like a soda can. Likewise more guns these days come with changable back straps (the P99 does) so whether you've got little girly hands or paws of destruction you'll be able to get fairly comfy. Then again plenty of people like the way Glock, HK, Sig, Springfields, and the like feel. All personal preference and remember just cause a guy is accurate with a $1200 custom target gun doesn't mean you can't be as accurate with a $500 off the shelf combat gun.

[TheSollyLama]

I also have a .40 S&W pistol, a Firestar with the 'Starvel' finish.

I'm not so sure about the 10mm. Statistically it's awesome- but the FBI bought them based on spec sheets (sound familiar, sportbikers????) and then hated the things.
Just too much felt recoil for quality follow on shots. Unless you buy the weapon, then drop even more money into compensators and the like, the recoil on most 10mm is pretty stout for close range combat.

Keep in mind the most realistic scenario for having to cap someone- either a street robbery (mugging), a car jacking, or home invasion.
In all cases you are likely at extremely close range, so a smaller, easily drawn gun is best, which makes large bore rounds a liability in terms of recoil. First shots, even at a couple feet are unlikely to hit, so a quality follow on is critical. Especially if the bad guy is also armed. He'll be able to put 3 rounds on low recoil 9mm out of his crappy Lorcin he got for a few crack rocks into a smaller space than you with a whopping 10mm hand cannon.
To me, the .40 represents a better compromise with good power and energy, but less recoil than a full 10mm.

Revolver grips can be changed, so grip feel isn't a very good reason to pan revolvers.

Also remember that buying a gun and actually being good with one is two different things. Simple ownership is worthless- you need to practice. 10mm ammo is pricey as is .40 cal. Another thing that makes the .357 a great weapon is that you can load up .38spl for target shooting and practice, save your wrist and frame stress on the gun, and shoot all day cheaply. 300-500 rounds cost about $50.

[peldor]

I also find that shooting overall is improved if you shot a lot of rounds, and it really doesn’t matter what type. I had a Ruger 22/45 pistol, it was just a .22LR but I would shoot thousands of rounds out of it just for fun. I got to where I could hit a soda can at almost 50 feet out. That experience carried over to every other pistol I have ever shot (given about a clip and it felt like I had been shooting that gun for a long time) so if you want to get good with pistols, shoot pistols. A Ruger 22/45 doesn’t cost that much (if I recall right I bought it at a gun show with two ten round clips and the guy threw in 500 rounds of CCI ammo for about $275. Not a bad deal. And it so cheap to shoot that you can go to the range and shoot the 30-meter targets all day and only be out like twenty bucks (and you are honing your hand eye skills)

[hybrid]

I own 2 glock model 20 10mm's. Both are full sized. I figure that while I am a skilled shooter, if I am in a situation that needs swift action I want something that will blow a hole in someone without needing a good location. If I hit you in the fuckin shoulder, your arm is pretty much gone. Remember, your trying to kill someone. Dead people dont sue you.

I will agree that the 10 is a cannon. I cant double tap that fucker for shit even with alot of practice and on a 9mm I can send two thru a 3X5 index card in the center of mass. I have since sent one out to have it worked on for control, magnum porting and spring/ trigger work. I hate the 8lbs of trigger pull and am switching to a 3lbs trigger. I have a medium sized hand (I wear a size 9 glove) and the grip is a little big for my hand but I will remedy that later.

Anyways, I have a variety of guns for different reasons, but the handgun for me is the 10mm and its for the straight reason of death, if the round doesnt kill you immediately I want to know your bleedin out quickly.

The rounds are pricey though, 20 bucks for 20 rounds of hydroshocks. practice ammo is 13-18 bucks for 50 rounds. NEVER, NEVER shoot someone with practice ammo out of a 10mm, it will blow thru someone and thru the next person behind them.

[Big15]

Originally Posted by hybrid

Remember, your trying to kill someone. Dead people dont sue you.

NO, you are shooting to stop a threat, not to kill someone. If you are involved in a shooting and the person is incapcitated and of no more threat to you and you continue firing you are opening yourself up to even more legal consequences. You are right though dead people don't sue you, their families do.

Originally Posted by hybrid

but the handgun for me is the 10mm and its for the straight reason of death

I think you need to re-evaluate your gun situation with those comments.

[TheSollyLama]

His point was that the shot should kill even if not a perfect hit.
That's more a matter for ammo though. A good round should inflict massive damage even in a grazing shot.

In my .357 I keep Hydra-Shoks. But in the .40 I keep Glasers.

In this society, I would rather kill someone than wound him. Dead men don't hire lawyers to cry sob stories to liberal jurors that prefer a time out for breaking and entering perps than lead poisoning.
No sympathy for a maimed person to worry about if he's pushing up daisies instead.

[peldor]

Originally Posted by TheSollyLama

His point was that the shot should kill even if not a perfect hit.
That's more a matter for ammo though. A good round should inflict massive damage even in a grazing shot.

In my .357 I keep Hydra-Shoks. But in the .40 I keep Glasers.

In this society, I would rather kill someone than wound him. Dead men don't hire lawyers to cry sob stories to liberal jurors that prefer a time out for breaking and entering perps than lead poisoning.
No sympathy for a maimed person to worry about if he's pushing up daisies instead.

+1 to that!

That is why a 12GA shotgun with 3"mag 00 buck is a VERY good home defence weapon, shoot center of mass and it like shooting someone 12 times with a .40 (they better hope they are pushing up daisies because if not they would be better off!)

[gixxerjake]

I have A S&W 9mm and a Kimber eclipse custom 45acp.
Both have be very reliably I have put about 1500 rounds thru both with no jams..

[hybrid]

Originally Posted by Big15

NO, you are shooting to stop a threat, not to kill someone. If you are involved in a shooting and the person is incapcitated and of no more threat to you and you continue firing you are opening yourself up to even more legal consequences. You are right though dead people don't sue you, their families do.



I think you need to re-evaluate your gun situation with those comments.

Matter of fact I think you need to re-evaluate your situation. If I ever even pull a gun on someone and point it in their direction they are getting shot. You sound like those pussies that run around waving guns cause they make you tough or something. I own my selection of weapons for killing if need be. When a hunter goes hunting does he try to just injure his intended prey? NO he kills it. When your faced with a situation that requires gun play, you had better be ready to kill someone. Dead people dont shoot at you, sue you or cause harm to anyone else. If anyone thinks that a leg shot is a good way to go because you dont want to kill someone, you dont need a gun. You cannot think reprocussions, if your thinking like that your the one who will be dead.

You may be right on the continual shooting of someone criticaly wounded and considered not a threat but why take the chance? People with your attitude are the ones that incarcerate people defending themselves. I hope you actually never have to be put in that situation. Me? I am prepared for whatever the dice show me.

[hybrid]

Originally Posted by peldor

+1 to that!

That is why a 12GA shotgun with 3"mag 00 buck is a VERY good home defence weapon, shoot center of mass and it like shooting someone 12 times with a .40 (they better hope they are pushing up daisies because if not they would be better off!)

I too believe the shotgun to be the weapon of choice for home invasion, handguns need better aim. With a 12GA its just: BOOM!!!.............WHAT UP?

[TheSollyLama]

The key is that you WILL see a court room. Jurors are supposed to carry their common sense with them, and evaluate your situation.

However, many people just have never been robbed, threatened, or shot at. So chances are that jury isn't experienced in what you went through to find yourself a defendant.

But they are human, and a guy in a wheelchair with tubes sticking out of him will play to a soft jury, as will a sob story about how the perp's mommy didn't hug him enough.
Better you defend against a family looking to cash in on their criminal's death (civil case) than on a guy eating thru a tube.

It's the fault of criminals and liberal apologists. They say they want to treat criminals like humans, but they end up making it smarter to kill a bad guy than incapacitate him.

And of course, on a personal level, if you invade my home you are threatening my daughter sleeping in the other room, which is more than enough reason for me to take my time in bleeding you like a stuck pig before you die.

My house, until I packed most of it up to move, had weaponry as decoration. Swords, flails, maces, axes, daggers- name it.
I'd have to tell a perp to hang on a minute while I decide what to kill him with. I personally like the double ball spiked flail.

And do not use buckshot! Buckshot will go thru a whole lotta walls before it stops. If you can't see what's on the other side of a wall- do not shoot anything that's likely to go thru that wall.
That's why i stick with Glasers mostly.
And also, a shotgun, even cut down, is a two handed weapon that's difficult to move around in closed spaces with. You're better off with a pistol, IMO. Despite the deterrant of the sound of a 12 gauge slide being racked.

[Stonecoldchavez]

For my first gun I got a Sig P239 in .40cal. It is a sweet gun. Fits nicely in the hand and conceals well. I would recommend it for you in the 9mm. You can always change the barrels....

One thing I would recommend before buying a pistol is to see how it fits in your hand. Pull the slide back and see if you can close the action easily with your thumb. To me that was key. I tried large size autos and found that on some of them my thumb could not reach to close the slide. Or the action was too stiff.

The ammo is key too. I have never had one misfire with my Sig. Never. regardless of the ammo. Unfortunately, I cannot say the same thing for my Glock 23. It does not "like" certain ammo. It has jammed on me when I have used PMC bullets a few times. Yes, the gun was clean. I clean them every time a shoot. But for some reason I like the Glock too. Just the way it feels.

I also changed the sites on my Sig. to nite-glo ones.

Stone

[Big15]

Originally Posted by hybrid

Matter of fact I think you need to re-evaluate your situation. If I ever even pull a gun on someone and point it in their direction they are getting shot. You sound like those pussies that run around waving guns cause they make you tough or something. I own my selection of weapons for killing if need be. When a hunter goes hunting does he try to just injure his intended prey? NO he kills it. When your faced with a situation that requires gun play, you had better be ready to kill someone. Dead people dont shoot at you, sue you or cause harm to anyone else. If anyone thinks that a leg shot is a good way to go because you dont want to kill someone, you dont need a gun. You cannot think reprocussions, if your thinking like that your the one who will be dead.

You may be right on the continual shooting of someone criticaly wounded and considered not a threat but why take the chance? People with your attitude are the ones that incarcerate people defending themselves. I hope you actually never have to be put in that situation. Me? I am prepared for whatever the dice show me.

No I bet you need to actually take a GOOD handgun self defense class and I guarantee you they don't say shoot to kill. You say I sound like the guy that goes around waving guns to make myself feel tough but you are the one that has the 10mm that can't shoot a doubletap with it. Why would you carry something you can't shoot well. You say you can doubletap with the 9mm well. That would be so much better of a gun for you to carry since you shoot it better. Even hear the saying I would rather have a hit with a .22 than a miss with a .45. You should not make assumptions about me and my beliefs. I am the furthest thing from a liberal. It doesn't matter if you kill the guy or not, you are more than likely going to get sued. If he is dead you will get sued by the family. I never said a thing about a leg shot or anything like that. You should shoot COM anytime you might have to shoot your weapon. I will state it again and I am not wrong on this. You shoot to stop a threat, not to kill. If the guys dies then so be it but you DON'T shoot to kill. Live in reality buddy, no matter what you say no one here, not me, not you, not anyone is prepared to pull that trigger if you ever need it and I hope none of us ever do.

Thanks for flaming me too, you show your maturity.

[Truck]

It's such a bullshit world today that we live in where some fucking loser can break into your house, attack you, and you get sued for defending yourself. What the fuck has happened to the world? It's my house, stay the hell out. If I wanted you here, I'd of left the door open. God, this fucking topic pisses me off to no end!