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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-12-2007, 10:19 PM Thread Starter
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Honda: CBR600F4i versus CBR600RR

So what’s the difference between an F4i and a 600RR? They’re both staples of Honda’s supersport marque in the 600cc class. So which one is right for you? That's for you to decide. Let’s talk about some of the differences between these machines…

Some of my own thoughts, neither are a great starter machine, but the F4i instills more confidence in the rider. F4i retails less, should have lower private party pricing, and is a generally more versatile machine; can also be used as a touring machine. I wouldn’t tour on a 600RR, but the 600RR is slightly more edged for the track. Rider fatigue sets in faster riding the 600RR than the F4i (but you might be different). F4i is more relaxed, 600RR more aggressive. The F4i look is a little more dated than the 600RR, but the handling is shaper on the 600RR. Better brakes on the 600RR.

Okay, enough of my opinion. Please draw your own conclusions of course. Do more research. Any corrections, please add them. Information is still coming out with the 2007 model, so please post up anything that’s changed, or anything I forgot. I don’t plan on riding a 2007 (although I’d love to), unless I buy one.

** Note: In no way will I be held liable for any errors, omissions, factory changes, or other data points that may be different, including my opinions. There are of course small differences like rake and trail that I didn’t include. I don’t think a lot of riders make their decisions on those data points, but whatever. There may be market differences (e.g. California-emissions machines), that may have some specification differences. The purpose of this post is to highlight the differences between the two 600cc-sized Honda sportbikes for the USDM.


F4i

• Introduced in the US market in 2001, and was an update to the carbureted F4 machine, part of the 600F legacy. The first F machine was the Hurricane and has been radically updated since (F1 Hurricane, F2, F3, and F4/i).

• The F4i has a comparably more relaxed feel. The clip-ons sit above the clamp for a more upright riding position, akin to a sport-touring machine. Same as the F4 machine. The rear sets are adjustable but not as aggressively mounted as the 600RRs.

• The 2001 debuted with a 371 lbs. dry weight, one of the lightest machines Honda has made. Colors offerings, 2001 – white/red, silver/black, red/black; 2002 – yellow/black, silver/red, red/black; 2003 – silver/red, silver/black.

• The first generation (2001 through 2003) F4i was a split seat. The pillion seat was a separate seat than the rider’s seat. This was different than the F4 machine that came to pass. The second iteration (2004 through 2006) featured the return of the “banana seat”, the pillion and rider seat are the same assembly. Colors changed too, 2004 – black/red, black/yellow; 2005 – maroon/grey, silver/grey; 2006 – blue/black, yellow/grey).

• The 2001 through 2003 machines are very much the same. There was some changes made to brakes and ECU, but they’re relatively minor. Most of the changes were the different colors available; this is similar to the 2004 through 2006 machines, where similarities are plentiful and the only real differences are choices in tank/fairing colors.

• Seat height for the 2001 through 2003 machine is 31.7 inches (may also find 31.9” measurements). Chain (525 size), bore x stroke (67mm x 42.5 mm), and displacement (599cc) have not changed.

• There are some minor changes in the brake systems, but in large part, the debut bike featured front brakes sized with 296mm disks coupled with four piston calipers. Rear brake was a single 220mm disk on the 2001 model year. Brakes are pretty decent, but performance is slightly less than the 600RR.

• The F4i is fitted with 120/70 front and 180/55 rear tires.

• Peak ponies for the 2001 machine are found at 12,500 RPMs, boasting around 94 HP, and torque crests at 47.9 ft-lbs. at 10,500 RPMs. There was some rumor that the 2003 had the most power, but this could not be confirmed. The 2004/06 iterations probably have similar power and torque figures.

• The driven sprocket changed in 2006, dropping a tooth from 46 (2001 through 2005) to 45 teeth. Drive sprockets had 16 notches.

• Top speed of the 2001 machine is around 155 MPH (actual, not indicated).

• Exhaust is a conventional, right-hand mounted pipe and muffler, opposes chain-side of swingarm. Ground clearance is slightly less than the 600RR, but for street use, probably not an issue.

• Has slightly more storage under seat than its 600RR ilk. Can easily fit an aftermarket fuel management system, alarm system, etc.

• Mirrors are acceptable, but don’t inspire any confidence. In my opinion, they offer a slightly better view of that tailgating SUV than its 600RR brethren.

• The front fairing offers more wind and precipitation protection than the 600RR. Because you’re sitting “in” on the F4i, you have a marginally better defense against bugs, wind and rain.

• Power delivery is pretty smooth and very predictable; the machine redlines a tad over 14,000 RPMs. Slight power drop after idle, perhaps around 4K RPMs.

• Quarter mile trap speeds (~120-130 mph) and times (low 11s) are similar to the “superior” 600RR.

• Same instrumentation cluster through the entire generation. No digital fuel gauge; however, there is a reserve indicator with bars. 4.8 gallon capacity tanks with 0.9 gallon integrated reserve (no manual petcock switching required).


600RR

• Introduced in the US market in 2003, and took the reign as the premier supersport in the Honda model lineup. This machine was fuel-injected like its F4i sibling, but architecturally modeled on the RC211V MotoGP race machine.

• This machine has relatively more aggressive ergonomics than the F4i; the clip-ons are below the yoke. The rides almost on top of the tank. Rear sets are also adjustable to the users preference, but are located in a higher, race-oriented position.

• The 2003 and 2004 model years are strikingly similar, with very few changes; dry weight was 370 lbs. The color choices were the only changes made to USDM bikes (2003 – red/black, black, and yellow; 2004 – red/black, black/silver, and blue).

• Some revitalization was made to the 2005 bike, which carried over to the 2006 model. These changes included small changes to the engine, exhaust, fairings, forks and swingarm; shedding 9 lbs (down to 361 lbs. dry weight). Color choices were different (black, black/grey tribal, silver, silver/black, and red/black; 2006 – orange/black tribal, black, silver, and red/black).

• The 2007 was a complete redesign; an incredible 20 lbs. were eliminated, and dry weight was dropped to 341 lbs, although Honda claims 345 lbs. Changes included almost everything; new engine, new frame, new rear brake system, new wheels, new fairings, new cooling system (w/ new radiator) and an updated version of the Honda Electronic Steering Damper (HESD) system. The front forks and rear suspension system carried over from the 2006 machine. Front brakes are of the same specification, but may be different part numbers. The wheelbase was shortened. Current colors are white/silver, blue/silver, red/black and black.

• Through 2003 to the current model, the chain (525 size), bore x stroke (67mm x 42.5 mm), seat height (32.3 in), dual headlamp configuration, and displacement (also 599cc) have not changed.

• Both generations have superior braking systems (than the F4i), and boast similar specs.

• The 600RR also features the 120/70, and 180/55 tire sizes, front and rear, respectively.

• Power peaks on the 2003/2006 iteration at 13,500 RPMs (100 HP). Twisting force hits its crescendo around 11,400 RPMs (41.6 ft-lbs.) No idea what the 2007 machine carries, but it’s probably marginal at best.

• 600RRs are factory geared with 16-tooth front sprockets and 43-tooth driven sprockets.

• Top speed is around 160 MPH (again, actual, not what the speedometer says, which will be higher due to factory programmed error).

• Exhaust system is center-up design, exhaust gases exit near the brake lamp under pillion seat. This helps give the machine more turning clearance.

• Has very little storage. You can store your registration papers, and that’s it.

• The mirrors on the 600RR are subjectively worse than the F4i. Although I haven’t reviewed the 2007 600RR, I’m sure they also give you an excellent view of your elbows.

• Although aftermarket screens are a popular mod, the factory windshields offer little element protection. You’re sitting “on” the machine.

• Very touchy throttle, and not as confidence inspiring as the F4i. The 2003/2006 machine redlines around 15,000 RPMs.

• Quarter mile trap speeds (~120-130 mph) and times (low 11s) are similar to the F4i; I’m sure the 2007 speeds and times are similar.

• Same instrumentation cluster from 2003 to 2006, 2007 has new gauges. Has a digital fuel gauge (not sure on 2007 model). Same fuel capacity and setup as F4i, also with automatic reserve.


Sources
• “Honda 600RR”. Wikipedia.org. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CBR600RR.
• “Honda CBR600F4i”. Wikipedia.org. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honda_CBR600F4i.
• “2003 Honda CBR600RR Timeline”. Sportrider.com. http://www.sportrider.com/bikes/2003...600rr_timeline.
• Kneedraggers.com.
• Neeves, Michael. “CBR v CBR: When the F is Better than the RR”. Motorcycle News. December 10, 2003.
• Personal knowledge.

Regards,
Mike


Last edited by mikem317; 06-12-2007 at 10:32 PM.
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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-13-2007, 07:33 AM Thread Starter
You got that right.
 
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Feel free to PM me or L8 Braker if anything needs to be edited.

Regards,
Mike

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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 06-13-2007, 07:56 AM
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Isn't it the front brakes that are different on the 2007 RR not the rear? Also on the storage thing, I can fit registration papers AND a pack of smokes in my RR.

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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 07-20-2007, 05:34 PM
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Okay so did they change any ergos on the F4i when they changed to the lame seat and lame colors?

I haven't been riding for a few years due to my last bike being stolen right as I quit my job to go back to school. This was right around when the RR was new and the F4i was still a killer bike, just a little outclassed by its younger brother. Now many people seem to think the F4i is a weak wussy bike but as far as I can tell nothing has really changed on it. As someone that loved his '00 F4, I think an F4i would be a great bike.

I didn't like the RC51's aggressive seating position and that leads me to believe I wouldn't like the 600RR so much. It's really a shame because the 600RR looks SO much better. And of course now they make the F4i look worse with the old seat and the ugly colors. It's saddening to see Honda treat such a sweet bike with such indignity.

Anyways, is the F4i today (second gen) still the same ergo's etc as the original? There are many places above where you mention the original F4i specs, leading me to believe that the newer ones are different...then you don't say anything about the newer one.

Thx,
D
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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 08-17-2007, 02:24 PM
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You can store a U-shaped lock in the 07 600RR! However, normal U-shaped locks won't fit, only the Honda U-shaped lock that costs like $150ish will fit in there. So forget about trying to use a $20 bike lock or something (not that it would accomplish much anyway).

However, I do have a pretty good view out of my rear views, I can see my elbows quite nicely - but other than that I am able to keep an eye on traffic behind me without hindering my capability to ride on.

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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 09-03-2007, 11:41 PM
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I have some new info for the 2007 model. So you can update the 2007 section.

2 sites claim the 07 seat is VERY comfy now!
http://www.amadirectlink.com/news/2006/cbr600rr/
Quote:
I'm particularly impressed with the ergonomics. In addition to the slightly higher handlebars, engineers changed the seat foam in a way that keeps your posterior more planted, letting you dial in the rest of your own personal comfort zone all the more easily.
http://www.motorcycledaily.com/18jun...supersport.htm
Quote:
Honda even found a comfortable seat for its 600 this year!

that last site, claims the RR has 118hp at the fly. 58lbs/tq. Somewhere I read, can't be for sure, that it said it had 108 at the wheel.

Roadracing World claimed the 07 RR is the best 600, EVER! (claimed on Honda's own site.).
http://powersports.honda.com/motorcy...=cbr.honda.com

Bike has ALOT of mid range grunt now. Where most of your riding will be, in the mid range.



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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 09-07-2007, 12:33 PM
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My Fi is the bike I've been riding since I learned, compared to the RR I agree it's definetly more forgiving.
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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 12-05-2007, 10:40 PM
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The f4i is by far more comfy and torquier on the low end. The RR handle way better when it comes down to it. I have one of each of these bikes and I ride the f4i to work and back but only ride the RR when I am gonna get on it or at the track.

The RR's guts are all up after 10 grand as opposed to the f4i which is way torquier at the bottom end. The f4i picks up the front end easier but the 66 feels like it wants to take your arms off when you get up on the RPMs.

If you are gonna do just mostly commuting, transportation or longer rides, get the f4i.

If you want the cool, sportier look and a more agressive bike that, in my opinion, handles much better under more agressive and extreme riding, get the RR.

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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-20-2008, 06:14 AM
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Awesome info! Thanks guys for taking the time to put it together
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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-21-2008, 11:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dbrowdy View Post
Okay so did they change any ergos on the F4i when they changed to the lame seat and lame colors?

I haven't been riding for a few years due to my last bike being stolen right as I quit my job to go back to school. This was right around when the RR was new and the F4i was still a killer bike, just a little outclassed by its younger brother. Now many people seem to think the F4i is a weak wussy bike but as far as I can tell nothing has really changed on it. As someone that loved his '00 F4, I think an F4i would be a great bike.

I didn't like the RC51's aggressive seating position and that leads me to believe I wouldn't like the 600RR so much. It's really a shame because the 600RR looks SO much better. And of course now they make the F4i look worse with the old seat and the ugly colors. It's saddening to see Honda treat such a sweet bike with such indignity.

Anyways, is the F4i today (second gen) still the same ergo's etc as the original? There are many places above where you mention the original F4i specs, leading me to believe that the newer ones are different...then you don't say anything about the newer one.

Thx,
D

havent seen any egro difference...but with a little coin you can get that pillon seat back...i swapped mine and i really love it now...

and the F4i is a sleeper...

most people curl their nose at it but it will get it in the twisties...havent rode the RR but maybe i can get one when i get back from Italy in 2011

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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-21-2008, 11:29 AM
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I had both an '04 F4i and an '04 RR in my garage at the same time...I still have the f4i...

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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-21-2008, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CBRWildChild View Post
havent seen any egro difference...but with a little coin you can get that pillon seat back...i swapped mine and i really love it now...

and the F4i is a sleeper...

most people curl their nose at it but it will get it in the twisties...havent rode the RR but maybe i can get one when i get back from Italy in 2011
Fuck yeah, I eat fuckers up on liter bikes all the time on my f4i. It just gets gnarly when that pipe starts dragging. You know they look at my f4i on their zx10s or grsr 1000s like a punk til its sliding around a corner past their asses.

The F4i has such great feedback, too. Even though I will sell my bike, I want to get the last year one and just put the split seat on it in a few years.

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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-21-2008, 02:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTejano View Post
Fuck yeah, I eat fuckers up on liter bikes all the time on my f4i. It just gets gnarly when that pipe starts dragging. You know they look at my f4i on their zx10s or grsr 1000s like a punk til its sliding around a corner past their asses.

The F4i has such great feedback, too. Even though I will sell my bike, I want to get the last year one and just put the split seat on it in a few years.
i didnt have any plans to do the swap...didnt even really think about it...i just wanted a bike and i ran across an 06 with 429 miles on it last year and just wanted to ride...i was off 2 wheels for about a year after my bike got stolen and i only had liability...

compared to my 1000RR...i really dont miss it much at all...the F4i is soo much more fun...and threre are a million mods out there...

as for the tail swap...its soo easy...and most of the bolts in the 2nd gen tail can be used on the 1st gen tail...and you have to relocate your ecm and voltage rectifier but its not bad at all...

i dont know what pipe you have on your bike but that D&D is pure sex above about 9 or 10k...it makes me want to go faster...but it sounds like a tractor at idle...

lemme know if you want an 06 tail for your 02 and keep your 02 tail for when you find your late model...

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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-21-2008, 03:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ElTejano View Post
The RR's guts are all up after 10 grand
That's no longer true as of the 2007 model. In fairness, the 2007 CBR 600RR and earlier years shouldn't really be considered the same cycle.

If nobody ever died doing it, how much fun could it be?

Last edited by moto44; 02-21-2008 at 04:02 PM.
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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 02-21-2008, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
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That's no longer true as of the 2007 model. In fairness, the 2007 CBR 600RR and earlier years shouldn't really be considered the same cycle.
Thats true, I am actually gonna sell the RR to get a new RR. I still havent run across anyone in a new RR that can ride it, though. Even at the track, I was getting behind them to see what they could do.. to bad the riders couldnt do shit.

I honestly, cant wait to take one to the track and get on it.

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