Why are 1/4 mile times on SS 1000s not dropping? - Sportbikes.net
General Sportbikes This area is for sport bike discussion in general. Topics that don't really belong anywhere else can go here. Questions can be answered and addressed to fully understand certain aspects of the sport. If your question is manufacturer specific please post it there.
Sponsored by: TCX Boots

User Tag List

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
post #1 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 11:12 AM Thread Starter
Slowpoke
 
yamirider's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Alabama
Age: 25
Posts: 1,631
Thanks: 3
Thanked 22 Times in 20 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
Why are 1/4 mile times on SS 1000s not dropping?

I've been curious about this. Why are the 1/4 mile times and roll-on times going up on a lot of new 1000s? Look at sportrider.com

Kawasaki Motorcycle Performance Numbers & Kawasaki Street Bike Quarter Mile Times at Sport Rider

The 05 ZX10R ran the 1/4 in 9.78. The 11 ZX10R needed 10.08. I know that the 2011 ZX10R makes more power and is a better bike...so what gives?

The story is the same with a lot of other new 1000s.

I know 1/4 mile times really don't matter much, I was just curious if anybody knew why they were getting worse.
yamirider is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 11:25 AM
the joke is in your hand
 
serpentracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: cincinnati, OH
Posts: 8,294
Thanks: 49
Thanked 759 Times in 497 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
 
my guess would be it's gearing ratios has changed to meet engine tune demands based on race notes from real world testing.
and not to mention you could easily get both of those numbers from one run to the next on both of those bikes. depends on how good of a rider is that's riding it.
serpentracer is offline  
post #3 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 11:31 AM
World Superbike Champion
 
oic0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Louisiana
Age: 31
Posts: 729
Thanks: 7
Thanked 148 Times in 104 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
 
Some testers have more balls and more skill.
There is also track temperature, altitude, and traction.

In my humble opinion, don't pay any attention to lap times or quarter mile times in comparison tests. Its not what the bike is capable of, its what the testers are capable of on that particular bike. A bike which they haven't had enough time to fully familiarize themselves with or dial in. If anything those numbers probably correlate the most strongly with "Easy to ride" factor.
oic0 is offline  
post #4 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 11:51 AM
Pit Bike Legend
 
stnkbg1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Escondido, CA
Age: 33
Posts: 3,339
Thanks: 663
Thanked 660 Times in 346 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
and maybe because liter bikes are not optimized for drag racing. It's not really part of the design criteria.
stnkbg1 is offline  
post #5 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 01:06 PM
Live to ride
 
binx_19's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Rapid Valley, South Dakota
Age: 33
Posts: 12,015
Thanks: 176
Thanked 496 Times in 324 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
Garage
does it really matter when stock bikes already can do 10s out of the box.

TEAM ALFALFA
Resume
"...to disarm the people - that was the best and most effectual way to enslave them." (George Mason)

"But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."
binx_19 is offline  
post #6 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 01:27 PM
World Superbike Champion
 
Kazairl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Western Nebraska
Age: 27
Posts: 673
Thanks: 23
Thanked 172 Times in 113 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
With a good rider most of them will do 9s. Uncorrected numbers.
Kazairl is offline  
post #7 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 03:15 PM
500 G.P. Champion
 
Tony216's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: I live in PA, and the voices live in my head.
Age: 42
Posts: 1,813
Thanks: 210
Thanked 428 Times in 307 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
Torque wins drag races.

Kissing the mirror is CENSORED
Tony216 is offline  
post #8 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 04:41 PM
Turbo nerd.
 
Tripped1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sandy Eggo
Age: 36
Posts: 13,655
Thanks: 42
Thanked 795 Times in 516 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
All of the super sports have similar geometry...


.....and none of them are well suited to 1/4 miles. They are limited by the chassis not the motors.

Quote:
I do wear a helmet, as a matter of fact, along with other protective gear. But, the fact that you “certainly hope” I wear a helmet is so condescending it makes me want to ride a tricycle completely naked doing doughnuts in your front yard screaming Beastie Boys lyrics at midnight. Trust me, you do not want that. My buttocks are extremely pale and unsightly, especially in moonlight.
~Random Interweb Dude whom I very much want to buy a beer.
Tripped1 is offline  
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Tripped1 For This Useful Post:
jk750 (11-09-2012), kevin_stevens (11-09-2012)
post #9 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 05:19 PM
BIRDMAN
 
ApriliaSL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: santa Barbara CA
Age: 40
Posts: 2,562
Thanks: 12
Thanked 43 Times in 30 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by stnkbg1 View Post
and maybe because liter bikes are not optimized for drag racing. It's not really part of the design criteria.
This.
The limits that are being hit are in the chassis design. They are designed to be nimble so shorter wheel base is desired.
Do nothing more than lower the bike and extend the swing arm and you'll shave a lot of time on the 1/4 run as more power can be applied with out the thing wanting to wheelie.
ApriliaSL is offline  
post #10 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 06:33 PM
500 G.P. Champion
 
Tony216's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: I live in PA, and the voices live in my head.
Age: 42
Posts: 1,813
Thanks: 210
Thanked 428 Times in 307 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
I'll be argumentative today on the geometry issue.

Swingarms are getting longer - good for drag racing. Plus, shocks are getting better adjustment. This can only help chassis set up.

To the best of my knowledge, they strap the front ends, so the front geometry is a non-factor.

There's only three things that make sense to me:

One - New liter bikes have less torque. Torque wins drag races. It's one of two reasons why the last time I saw a prostock Suzuki motor, it was based on a GS motor, not a GSXR.

Two - Track condition. It's a wild card. I imagine most magazines test in CA. With all of the crazy weather in CA, I can't imagine the tracks being consistent from year to year.

Three - I'm assuming that magazines do their 1/4 miles tests with take-offs from "roadrace" track testing. Tires are stiffer today than they were way back when. Dropping air pressure will still have a relatively stiff tire.

You would really need to get a 05 ZX10 for example and run it on the track with a new S1000RR on the same day to see if it's bike or some other factor.

Kissing the mirror is CENSORED
Tony216 is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to Tony216 For This Useful Post:
scythe08 (11-09-2012)
post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 08:25 PM
Turbo nerd.
 
Tripped1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Sandy Eggo
Age: 36
Posts: 13,655
Thanks: 42
Thanked 795 Times in 516 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tony216 View Post
I'll be argumentative today on the geometry issue.

Swingarms are getting longer - good for drag racing. Plus, shocks are getting better adjustment. This can only help chassis set up.

To the best of my knowledge, they strap the front ends, so the front geometry is a non-factor.

There's only three things that make sense to me:

One - New liter bikes have less torque. Torque wins drag races. It's one of two reasons why the last time I saw a prostock Suzuki motor, it was based on a GS motor, not a GSXR.

Two - Track condition. It's a wild card. I imagine most magazines test in CA. With all of the crazy weather in CA, I can't imagine the tracks being consistent from year to year.



Three - I'm assuming that magazines do their 1/4 miles tests with take-offs from "roadrace" track testing. Tires are stiffer today than they were way back when. Dropping air pressure will still have a relatively stiff tire.

You would really need to get a 05 ZX10 for example and run it on the track with a new S1000RR on the same day to see if it's bike or some other factor.
Unless you are talking a stretched bike strapping doesn't do a lot. Seventy-foot pounds with an a 55" wheelbase means wheelie, and about all of the 1000cc bikes and up can pull it.


For reference I've spent a LOT of time at drag strips, both two wheel and four wheel.

Quote:
I do wear a helmet, as a matter of fact, along with other protective gear. But, the fact that you “certainly hope” I wear a helmet is so condescending it makes me want to ride a tricycle completely naked doing doughnuts in your front yard screaming Beastie Boys lyrics at midnight. Trust me, you do not want that. My buttocks are extremely pale and unsightly, especially in moonlight.
~Random Interweb Dude whom I very much want to buy a beer.
Tripped1 is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to Tripped1 For This Useful Post:
scythe08 (11-09-2012)
post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 09:47 PM
NO LAG !!!
 
SPOOLN GSXR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: NEW BERN, NC
Age: 32
Posts: 1,255
Thanks: 38
Thanked 21 Times in 16 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
Bikes aren't getting slower. Go look at the Mirock series or go talk to Brock Davidson. We are doing more with less. The stock setups aren't ideal but, don't get it twisted. WHP wins races with sportbikes and trap speeds back that up. We aren't too worried about torque because we are taking off at such high rpms. Torque just makes them easier to launch. Also an 05' ZX-10R can't run with a S1000RR. Brock Davidson proved that in both stock wheelbase and stretched form. The fastest times ever ran on a stock motor 1000 was with the BMW. The articles below are about all the records the BMW set on it's debut into drag racing.

The long road trip to the short drag strip/BMW International Press Release : Dragbike Live.com

Brocks Performance: Horsepower Shootout: BMW S1000RR Vs. the World!

Brocks Performance: BMW S 1000 RR US Press Introduction

BMW S 1000RR to the 8th & 3rd power! : Dragbike Live.com

- ROC
Fast, cheap, reliable... pick two!
SPOOLN GSXR is offline  
The Following User Says Thank You to SPOOLN GSXR For This Useful Post:
Technomancer (11-10-2012)
post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 09:52 PM
NO LAG !!!
 
SPOOLN GSXR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: NEW BERN, NC
Age: 32
Posts: 1,255
Thanks: 38
Thanked 21 Times in 16 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
 
Here's a youtube...

BMW S1000RR 1/4 mile performance test with Keith Dennis - YouTube

- ROC
Fast, cheap, reliable... pick two!
SPOOLN GSXR is offline  
post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 10:07 PM
the joke is in your hand
 
serpentracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: cincinnati, OH
Posts: 8,294
Thanks: 49
Thanked 759 Times in 497 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 3 Post(s)
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by SPOOLN GSXR View Post
Bikes aren't getting slower. Go look at the Mirock series or go talk to Brock Davidson. We are doing more with less. The stock setups aren't ideal but, don't get it twisted. WHP wins races with sportbikes and trap speeds back that up. We aren't too worried about torque because we are taking off at such high rpms. Torque just makes them easier to launch. Also an 05' ZX-10R can't run with a S1000RR. Brock Davidson proved that in both stock wheelbase and stretched form. The fastest times ever ran on a stock motor 1000 was with the BMW. The articles below are about all the records the BMW set on it's debut into drag racing.



Brocks Performance: Horsepower Shootout: BMW S1000RR Vs. the World!

whoever rode the bikes did it no justice. only a 10.04 with a 178.8 hp bike? weak sauce.


rickey gadson got a stock 05 R6 in the 9's with no mods done to it.

Today, in Palmdale, California, WITH A 25 MPH HEAD/CROSS WIND, in front of all the Cycle World editors and representatives of Ducati, Honda, Triunph, Suzuki, Kawasaki, and Yamaha, Rickey G does the impossible.In a test for Cycle World for the best Middle Weight bike out, Dragracing has now experienced it's first BONE STOCK 9 second 600 pass..... Or passes!!! Guess what....... It wasn't on a Kawasaki. The Yamaha R6, ran a BLISTERING 9.93@135mph, backed up by a 9.98@135mph. The numbers were.....
1.54 60'
4.17 330'
111mph 1/8mi.
9.93@135mph

NOTE, these bikes are the dictionary definition of stock. NO WEIGHT, stock pipes, -1 front sprocket, lowered, no race gas or motor work, and THAT'S IT!!!!

The test bikes included the Ducati 749, Triumph 650, Honda CBR 600RR, Suzuki GSXR 600, Kawasaki ZX-6R, and Yamaha R6. The test started with ALL the bikes at stock height. The Ducati went 10.71@127mph. The Triumph went 10.60@129mph( ). The Honda went 10.42@130mph. The Suzuki went 10.39@128mph. The Yamaha went 10.36@132. And last but not least, the Kawasaki went 10.34@132mph. What is the fastest you've ever seen a stock height 600 go??? i guarantee it isn't three tenths of those #'s!!!

They then decided to take the two fastest bikes and lower them. That was the Yamaha and the Kawasaki. The Suzuki was down on horsepower and had the second to lowest mph with near flawless passes, while the Kawi and the Yamaha were the only two bike that he could not keep on the ground in first gear. These factors are what made the Kawi and the Yamaha the chosen bikes.

With 2" ground clearance, the first pass for the Kawasaki was a 10.16, with a 1.55 60', but the shock was hitting the swingarm so they had to raise it back up. Then, 4 passes later, with a 1.58 60' and a 4.27 330', the Kawi went 10.02@135mph. The first pass for the Yamaha was 10.12. Then 3 passes later, with a 1.55 60' and a 4.23 330', the Yamaha went 9.98@135mph. Them came back and went a 1.54 60' and a 4.17 330', and went 9.93@135.

Now, this is getting Crazy!!!! I honestly can't believe that a stock 600 went 9's. I wish there was still a 600ss class. If these bikes were setup S/S legally, they will go 9.50's easy!!!!

Stay tuned fellas, Rickey Gadson will go to Cali next month to test ALL the new 1000's!!!! THAT should be interesting!!!!

Last edited by serpentracer; 11-09-2012 at 10:10 PM.
serpentracer is offline  
post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-09-2012, 10:13 PM
After Me Lucky Charms
 
Shamrock627's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Kentucky
Age: 44
Posts: 5,165
Thanks: 865
Thanked 696 Times in 452 Posts
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)
 
I would venture a guess, and say it's the EPA cracking down.
Shamrock627 is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Sportbikes.net forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in









Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Linear Mode



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
1/4 mile times? surrender ZZR-600 25 03-26-2010 02:30 PM
1/4 Mile Times? Fizzfuzz FZ6/FZ6R 9 08-08-2006 02:02 PM
Will dropping your bike multiple times tweak frame? MT Wallet General Sportbikes 25 09-11-2005 10:01 AM
1/4 mile times jeffzx9 Kawasaki Sportbikes 18 04-14-2002 09:11 AM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome