What is your opion on starting with a 600

[robbieace]

I haven't been around this forum for very long but i have noticed that many people here are very against startin with a 600. Personally i started on a 750 and i had no problem with it. Let's hear some points of view and reasons why or why not to get a 600.

[CasterTroy]

One word

Sexydude


Do a search in the archives on this username

Getting ANY 600cc for a first bike is a bad idea that may also be an expensive form of suicide. Even worse is getting a BRAND NEW 600cc bike. Here are a few reasons why.




1. Knowledge of Subject Matter

Right now your at the most basic beginners period, the very start of the learning curve (i.e. you aren’t even aware of what is that you don't know). A personal example of this is when I started taking Shotokan Karate. On the first day of class I didn’t even know what “inside-block” was, let alone how to do it with correct form. After I learned a bit, then I could start to realize how bad my form was and begin the process of improving it. I had to become AWARE that inside-blocks even existed before I could realize that I couldn’t do them correctly. This is to say that it takes knowledge OF something to be able to understand how something works, functions, performs, etc. Having NO motorcycle experience, you’re not even aware of the power, mistakes, handling, shifting, turning dynamics etc. of any bike, let alone a sport bike. In the process of moving through the learning curve you begin to amass all this new information…you also make a ton of mistakes.



2. The Learning Curve

When you’re learning to do something, you make mistakes. Without them the learning process is impossible. Making mistakes on a sport bike can be fatal. The thing newbies need to learn above anything else is smooth throttle control and proper speed & lean going into turns. On a 600cc bike, a mistake with throttle control or a turn can cost you your life before even knew what happened. A bike that is less forgiving of mistakes (ninja ex 250, 500, or an OLDER 600cc bike) is far safer to learn on.

Ask yourself this question; in which manner would you rather learn to walk on tightropes A) with a 4x4 board that is 2 feet off the ground B) with a wire that is 20 feet off the ground? Most sensible people would choose “A”. The reason why is obvious. Unfortunally safety concerns with a first motorcycle aren’t as apparent as they are in the example above. However, the wrong choice of what equipment to learn on can be just as deadly…regardless of how safe, careful, and level-headed you are.



3. I’ll be Safe, Responsible, And Level-Headed While Learning".

Sorry, but that excuse doesn’t cut it. To be safe you also need SKILL (throttle control, speed, leaning, etc). Skill comes ONLY with experience. To gain that experience you must ride your bike in real traffic, with real cars, and real dangers. Before skills are developed which can foster safe riding, you need a bike that can mirror the level of safety that you’re currently at, not a cutting edge race bike that will throw you off the first chance it has.

Imagine someone saying, "I want to learn to juggle, but I’m going to start by learning with chainsaws. But don’t worry, I’ll go slow, be careful, and stay level-headed while I’m learning". Like the tightrope example above, the answer here is isn’t hard to see. Be careful all you want, go as slow as you want, be as cautious as you want…your still juggling chainsaws! Without a foundation in place of HOW to juggle there is only a small level of safety you can aspire towards. As such, it’s better to learn the skills of juggling with tennis balls first. The same holds true for learning to ride a motorcycle.



4. I Don’t Want A Bike I’ll Outgrow'

Please. Did your Momma put you in size 9 shoes at age 2? Get with the program.




5. Cost (“I don’t want to waste money on a bike I’ll only have for a short period of time”)



Smaller bikes have good resale value, because other (smart) people will want them as learner bikes. You’ll prolly be able to sell a used learner bike for as much as you paid for it.
If you drop your brand new bike that is fresh off the showroom floor while your learning (and you will), you've just broken a directional, perhaps a brake / clutch lever, cracked / scrapped the fairings ($300.00 each to replace), #### up the bar ends, etc. It's better and cheaper to drop a #### bike that you don’t care about than one you just spent 8k on. Most newbies drop bikes going under 20MPH, when the bike is at its most unstable periods. They often only don’t result in physical injury, just a big dent in your pride and….







6. EGO



Worried about looking like tool on a smaller bike? Well, you'll look even more like a tool with a brand new, but ####-up, 2004 bike (or a new bike that you can’t get out 1st gear without stalling 15 times). Any real rider would give you props for going about learning to ride the *correct* way (i.e. on a learner bike). If you’re stressed about impressing someone with a “cool” bike, or embarrassed about being on small bike then your not mature enough to handle the responsibility of a motorcycle. Try a moped. After you've grown up revisit the idea of a motorcycle.



6. "Don’t ask advice if you don't want to hear the answers".



A common pattern:

1) Person X asks for advice on a 1st bike (wanting to hear certain answers)

2) Experienced rider’s advice against a 600cc bike for a first ride (this isn’t what Person X wanted to hear).

3) Person X thinks, "Others #### up while learning, but that wont happen to me" (as if they are invincible, hold superpowers, have a ‘level head’, etc).

4) Experienced riders explain why a ‘level head’ isn’t enough.

5) Person X makes up excuses as to why veterans riders “don’t understand why I’d be able to handle a 600cc bike whole others can’t”.

6) Person X as a total newbie, who couldn't even tell you what a shift pattern is, by some grace of God now understands what the best bike to buy is and totally disregards all the advice he asked for in the first place (which brings us right back to the very first point I made about knowledge).



I’m not trying to be harsh, I’m being real. Look all over the net. You’ll see person after person after person telling newbies NOT to get a 600cc bike. Why? Because we hate them? Because we don't want others to have cool bikes? No way. The more riders the better (assuming there not squids)! The reason people like me and countless others spend so much time writing huge rants on this subject is because we actually care about you. We don't want to see people get hurt. We don't want to see more people die in senseless accidents that could have been avoided with a little logic and patients. We WANT you to be around to ride that 600cc bike you desire so badly. However, we just want you to be able to ride it in a safe manner that isn’t going to be a threat to yourself or others. I hope this was of some help, and feel free to email me with any questions.

Speaking of help, this is a great time to plug the MSF (Motorcycle Safety Foundation) course. The MSF course is a GREAT learning opportunity for new riders. The courses are offered all over the USA. I listed a link for their web page at the bottom of this post (or do a Goggle search and check you local RMV web page.). The MSF course assumes no prior knowledge of motorcycles and teaches the basics of how to ride a bike with out killing yourself (and NO, just because you passed the MSF course dose not mean your ready for an R6, GSX, CBR, etc). They provide motorcycles and helmets for the course. It is by far THE BEST way to start a motorcycle career that I hope will last you lifetime. Again I hope this information helped, and feel free to email me with any questions.

-chr|s sedition

Boston, MA

sedition@pipeline.com

www.msf-usa.org

[firefighter81]

I've stated this before fairly recently, but I'll sort of summarize what I said before.

If you want to become a HIGHLY SKILLED rider eventually, start smaller, it's a proven fact that this works. Some people start on Hayabusas and don't wreck at all, does that mean they are a good rider? Nope, it means they are very lucky. Smaller bikes are alot easier to handle in emergency situations, I'm not going to go over all of them, just check any of the "start small" links. When someone is on a larger (more powerful) bike and they panic, that bike won't be as forgiving as a smaller displacement (lower power) bike. There are so many reasons not to start on a SS600 all you have to do is search the forum, you'll find plenty of "new rider crashes" articles.

This brings up an interesting thought I've been having. A Ducati isn't exactly the best beginner bike, but how does that Ducati Monster 620 behave for a new rider? Are they fairly tame? I had the pleasure of riding an S4R a month or so ago, but that's the only Monster I've ridden.

[robbieace]

i don't agree with the first post

[FunCrusher]

"how many miles have you been riding?"
thats the question your going to get,so write your answer and have it ready to copy and paste.

Although I may get flamed,My personal opinion... ,If you want to become a good rider,go on the track and learn how to drag the knee,etc; start on a 250 or a 500 go to the track and stay off the street,if you just want to ride on the street ,pose,or stunt,a 600 isnt too bad.(Actually if you want to stunt a dirtbike or a 600 is best to learn on )
Ive seen both riders who have had and had no expirience mess up bad on a 600.I started out on a katana maybe 3 or so years ago,now I have a gsxr 600 and it still scares me Ill admit.Though Im more into stunting and just commuting than racing on the track with my bike.
I am a member of PCA though and i race my porsche 944 turbo strictly on the track,road racing that is and am trying to build a 930 turbo for drag racing in the near future.So i get my track thrills from that.( Boy the heat i get for drag racing a porsche,you can only imagine! but blah,f*ck tradition)
So i guess,in my opinion,it isnt too bad too start on a 600 cc bike depending the situation and person,but on the other hand some people dont belong on any bike period.

[RACER X]

http://www.beginnerbikes.com/editori...lsfunction.htm

http://home.earthlink.net/~thebradfords/startsmall.htm

typed it TOO many times.

what do you mean by "i've made it" tell us your history.........or what you percieve as your skill level?

[RSixxygrl]

6. EGO



Worried about looking like tool on a smaller bike? Well, you'll look even more like a tool with a brand new, but ####-up, 2004 bike (or a new bike that you can’t get out 1st gear without stalling 15 times). Any real rider would give you props for going about learning to ride the *correct* way (i.e. on a learner bike). If you’re stressed about impressing someone with a “cool” bike, or embarrassed about being on small bike then your not mature enough to handle the responsibility of a motorcycle. Try a moped. After you've grown up revisit the idea of a motorcycle.


==============================================================

That's 95% of it right there!!!! Ego will get you no where...........

[Squid Killer]

Just because you started out on a 750 doesnt mean you are any good or a safe rider.

[RSixxygrl]

Originally Posted by robbieace

i don't agree with the first post

Well of course you wouldn't

[CasterTroy]

Originally Posted by robbieace

i don't agree with the first post

And you don't have to


Noone is twisting your arm, but WHEN you become a statistic, we'll reference you in the same warning we issue to newbies along side of the story of sexydude and his R6 his daddy bought for him that ultimatly killed him a week later


Not trying to strut and proudly display my rank/years on the board, but I've seen SOOO many young, cocky little pricks come on and spout off about how the safety nazi's talk down on starting on a 600......then they fade away once they take their first spill on said 600




it happens dude...seen it WAY too many times.....don't care to see it again. THATS why we talk it down

[dennisred69]

i started on a 600 and it took a long time before i could ride the way it was ment to be ridden yes you can start on one but the time and effort it takes to be smoth and flowing will take longer

[robbieace]

Originally Posted by Squid Killer

Just because you started out on a 750 doesnt mean you are any good or a safe rider.

It proves that for some people can start on a bigger bike and be just as good as if they start on a 500. I rode my 750 for two years and i just recently moved up to a 929 and i feel that i am a safer rider than most of the other people on the road.

[CasterTroy]

Originally Posted by robbieace

It proves that for some people can start on a bigger bike and be just as good as if they start on a 500. I rode my 750 for two years and i just recently moved up to a 929 and i feel that i am a safer rider than most of the other people on the road.

You also think fear and respect are the same thing

[RSixxygrl]

Yep Haden and Rossi started big too...they are awesome riders!!!! Street, dirt, track...they can do it all...glad they got on those 900s at such an early age!! :flip

[Neverlose]

Here we go agaaaaaaaiiin....